1 2015-12-20T00:03:41  <Luke-Jr> berndj: and if different programs we use use different Python versions?
  2 2015-12-20T00:04:14  <Luke-Jr> the language used by external programs really ought to be transparent to us
  3 2015-12-20T00:04:18  <Luke-Jr> opaque*
  4 2015-12-20T00:06:31  <Luke-Jr> hmm
  5 2015-12-20T00:06:46  <Luke-Jr> approaching this the wrong way I think
  6 2015-12-20T00:07:01  <Luke-Jr> PYTHONPATH should probably be treated like PATH, which isn't overridden in Makefile at all
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 72 2015-12-20T10:33:32  <maaku> #7230 is locked with conversation limited to contributors only
 73 2015-12-20T10:34:00  <maaku> that's effectively useless given how bitcoin development works...
 74 2015-12-20T10:34:19  <maaku> would recommend closing if it is too contentious to oeprate effectively as a PR
 75 2015-12-20T10:40:03  <jgarzik> maaku, unlocked.  Hopefully vote brigading will not continue.
 76 2015-12-20T10:41:11  <Luke-Jr> it would be nice if there was a good migration path to a decentralised development environment :/
 77 2015-12-20T10:43:36  <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, you mean off-github?
 78 2015-12-20T10:44:26  <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: well, GitHub could probably easily get a better permissions system; more problematic IMO is the concept of rebasing
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 80 2015-12-20T10:44:44  <Luke-Jr> at least as it works with git, it makes decentralised development basically impossible
 81 2015-12-20T10:44:54  <Luke-Jr> since every rebase conflicts with the previous incarnation
 82 2015-12-20T10:45:37  <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, in an ideal world rebasing is evil, and git merge should be used instead
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 84 2015-12-20T10:46:01  <Luke-Jr> O.o
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 87 2015-12-20T10:47:00  <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: more or less agree; but I don't know an easy way to get to the point where PRs aren't being rebased anymore
 88 2015-12-20T10:47:45  <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, (reconnecting)   You've rediscovered what Linus tells people every week --
 89 2015-12-20T10:48:03  <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, rebasing is evil, and git merge should be used instead.   It is more decentralized.
 90 2015-12-20T10:48:23  <Luke-Jr> intereting, didn't know he also held such a position
 91 2015-12-20T10:48:43  <Luke-Jr> git seemed IMO to encourage rebasing because of git-log's defaults
 92 2015-12-20T10:48:44  <jgarzik> git merge is designed for decoupled development, where trees and code and developers (obviously!) move in parallel, at different rates.
 93 2015-12-20T10:49:15  <Luke-Jr> contrast with Bazaar, which basically defaults to --first-parent and treats the merge commit message as a summary of all under it
 94 2015-12-20T10:49:19  <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, rebasing screws anyone following a tree
 95 2015-12-20T10:50:00  <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, if you rebase, in kernel development, you get flamed by Linus for anti-social (anti-dev) behavior :)
 96 2015-12-20T10:50:16  <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: well, you have my vote for not asking people to rebase/squash on PRs ;)
 97 2015-12-20T10:50:51  <Luke-Jr> would be a nice surprise to find out we all hate rebasing, and were just going along with it to fit in with the norm :P
 98 2015-12-20T10:51:01  <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, the main problem on the flip side is devs obsessively git-merge'ing upstream into the current branch
 99 2015-12-20T10:52:26  <Luke-Jr> a ready-to-pull-please-merge ACK might work well, provides the merge+pull are timely so they don't overlap with other merge+pulls.
100 2015-12-20T10:53:31  <Luke-Jr> (or alternatively, committers could do the merge themselves, but that might increase their workload and require more)
101 2015-12-20T10:54:43  <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, Yes, correct -- the developer's job is making a PR "merge ready" -- meaning the committer doesn't have a lot of work do during the merge.   On the developer side, for long-lived PRs, that means "push a periodic git-merge as upstream tree changes dictate, to maintain the low burden on the committer"
102 2015-12-20T10:55:04  <jgarzik> tl;dr if upstream shit breaks your shit, fix your shit, otherwise leave it
103 2015-12-20T10:55:53  <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: sure; those can be minimised by only doing it when upstream changes *significantly* or when it's ready for pulling
104 2015-12-20T10:56:26  <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, right
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108 2015-12-20T11:05:29  <midnightmagic> the real problem is that a scrupulously maintained merge branch can still diverge.
109 2015-12-20T11:05:33  <midnightmagic> not all scm have that problem.
110 2015-12-20T11:06:32  <Luke-Jr> midnightmagic: ?
111 2015-12-20T11:08:22  <midnightmagic> a git merge doesn't always follow refactoring so well; and certainly many forms of git activity simply can't be merged cleanly at all with the native git merge tools. the base-finding mechs for three-way merge are rudimentary and primitive, if they exist at all, and there's no memory of merge credits for past-considered changes.
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159 2015-12-20T23:48:02  <GitHub4> [bitcoin] dgenr8 opened pull request #7236: Use createrawtx locktime parm in txn_clone (master...use_rpc_locktime_clone) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/7236