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  3 2018-03-16T00:00:36  <promag> sipa: I was reading that one, are you going to remove the remaining REF usages?
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  5 2018-03-16T00:01:40  <sipa> promag: i'm going to remove all casts from the serialization code, see #10785
  6 2018-03-16T00:01:44  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/10785 | Serialization improvements by sipa · Pull Request #10785 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
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 11 2018-03-16T00:16:43  <kallewoof> I'm a little confused by luke-jr's comment on {sign/verify}message replacement thread. He is saying not specific UTXO's but prove that funds are available. How would you do that, if you didn't sign for specific UTXO's?
 12 2018-03-16T00:17:18  <kallewoof> Basically, he wants to be able to prove that funds are available using a signature, since that's often what people do with signmessage today.
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 27 2018-03-16T00:51:28  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] kallewoof opened pull request #12701: [wallet] importprivkey: explicit rescan for known key (master...importprivkey-explicit-rescan) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/12701
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 32 2018-03-16T00:59:33  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] kallewoof opened pull request #12702: [wallet] [rpc] [doc] importprivkey: hint about importmulti (master...importprivkey-importmulti-hint) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/12702
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 34 2018-03-16T01:01:45  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] kallewoof closed pull request #12701: [wallet] importprivkey: explicit rescan for known key (master...importprivkey-explicit-rescan) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/12701
 35 2018-03-16T01:02:34  <promag> kallewoof: IMO all RPC that are a subset of importmulti should be deprecated
 36 2018-03-16T01:02:47  <sipa> well not right now
 37 2018-03-16T01:02:56  <sipa> importmulti can't deal with P2SH-P2WPKH addresses yet
 38 2018-03-16T01:03:02  * sipa adds to TODO list
 39 2018-03-16T01:03:15  <promag> sipa maybe never (so it doesn't break anything)
 40 2018-03-16T01:03:21  <sipa> ?
 41 2018-03-16T01:04:02  <promag> I mean, existing software would have to change if we deprecated those calls
 42 2018-03-16T01:04:17  <sipa> deprecating doesn't mean removing
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 44 2018-03-16T01:04:29  <promag> sipa: means it will be removed
 45 2018-03-16T01:04:33  <promag> no?
 46 2018-03-16T01:04:39  <promag> eventually.. :P
 47 2018-03-16T01:04:41  <sipa> yes, at some point in the future
 48 2018-03-16T01:04:43  <sipa> exactly
 49 2018-03-16T01:04:55  <sipa> we're deprecating and removing things all the time
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 51 2018-03-16T01:05:46  <promag> anyway, IMO the note should be "use importmulti instead, even for 1 entry"
 52 2018-03-16T01:06:12  <kallewoof> promag: I'm fine with that, but sipa noted that there are cases where you cannot use importmulti.
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 54 2018-03-16T01:06:40  <sipa> well we should fix that :)
 55 2018-03-16T01:06:40  <kallewoof> promag: So I'm keeping it as is. To be updated once P2SH-P2WPKH support is added to importmulti.
 56 2018-03-16T01:07:11  <kallewoof> sipa: Yeah that would be ideal, I suppose
 57 2018-03-16T01:07:55  <promag> is there a plan for that sipa?
 58 2018-03-16T01:08:08  <sipa> I hereby instate such a plan.
 59 2018-03-16T01:08:41  <sipa> (it's listed as a future TODO in #11403
 60 2018-03-16T01:08:45  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/11403 | SegWit wallet support by sipa · Pull Request #11403 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
 61 2018-03-16T01:14:37  <kallewoof> Weird that the importmulti says `"rescan": <false>   (boolean, optional, default: true)`. Sending mixed signals there lol...
 62 2018-03-16T01:15:06  <sipa> lol
 63 2018-03-16T01:15:09  <sipa> that should be fixed
 64 2018-03-16T01:15:27  <kallewoof> Yeah, it's no biggie, but it had me scratching my head for a sec.
 65 2018-03-16T01:17:10  <kallewoof> Also feels like "scriptPubKey": "<script>" | { "address":"<address>" } could just be... "scriptPubKey" : "<script or address>" since I don't think there's ever a case where you would confuse an addy for a script or vice versa.
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 67 2018-03-16T01:17:40  <kallewoof> Or rather, you can always determine which it is, I think.
 68 2018-03-16T01:17:42  <sipa> the design makes things intentionally explicit
 69 2018-03-16T01:17:58  <sipa> to minimize risk for having the RPC doing something other than what you intend
 70 2018-03-16T01:18:09  <sipa> you also have to explicitly say you want something as watch only etc
 71 2018-03-16T01:18:26  <kallewoof> sipa: Gotcha. Yeah, that makes sense.
 72 2018-03-16T01:18:39  <sipa> it's certainly not the easiest thing to use as a human
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 74 2018-03-16T01:18:47  <sipa> but for programmatic access, none of these things matter
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 76 2018-03-16T01:19:22  <kallewoof> *nod*
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 78 2018-03-16T01:20:45  <promag> +1
 79 2018-03-16T01:21:30  <promag> it doesn't try to guess, but it validates the input
 80 2018-03-16T01:22:16  <promag> out of battery o/
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 93 2018-03-16T02:11:47  <jimpo> :facepalm:
 94 2018-03-16T02:13:16  <sipa> hah
 95 2018-03-16T02:14:20  <sipa> jimpo: i just had a look at bip157/158; do you think it's really necessary that the extended filter is mandatory for the p2p protocol?
 96 2018-03-16T02:15:06  <jimpo> There was some discussion about how to do support for multiple filter types
 97 2018-03-16T02:15:30  <jimpo> the first draft had a getcftypes/cftypes message pair where a client could query a node's supported filters
 98 2018-03-16T02:16:13  <jimpo> but BlueMatt pointed out that it is something you want to filter nodes for before connecting (ie. exposed through addr advertisements)
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100 2018-03-16T02:16:29  <sipa> i guess i mostly don't understand why the extended filter is useful
101 2018-03-16T02:16:36  <jimpo> so that was dropped and the service bit mandates nodes support all currently defined types
102 2018-03-16T02:17:06  <sipa> so it seems like a waste of space
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104 2018-03-16T02:18:44  <sipa> but maybe i'm just missing the use case
105 2018-03-16T02:18:47  <jimpo> hmm, I can't remember the reason right now. roasbeef would know.
106 2018-03-16T02:19:23  <sipa> also, are there some numbers for how large the fikters typically are?
107 2018-03-16T02:19:45  <jimpo> I'm collecting that data right now actually
108 2018-03-16T02:19:49  <sipa> cool
109 2018-03-16T02:20:11  <sipa> ideally it should be some small multiple of 20 bits per element, i expect.
110 2018-03-16T02:21:45  <jimpo> right, the question is how many elements are expected per tx and how big they are compared to 20 bits
111 2018-03-16T02:21:57  <jimpo> I should have an answer shortly
112 2018-03-16T02:22:13  <jimpo> Thx for taking a look at the BIPs
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115 2018-03-16T02:24:43  <sipa> i also suggested before that it may be better to index just the entire scriptPubKey rather than individual pushes in it (every realistic output type these days has just one push, so for practical things it's the same, and has less risk for someone filling up the filter with many tiny pushes)
116 2018-03-16T02:24:59  <sipa> but maybe that's a bit late to change (or there is another reason i'm missing)
117 2018-03-16T02:26:56  <jimpo> Regarding the extended filter, it sounds like there aren't concrete applications right now, but it's for more complex contracting applications
118 2018-03-16T02:27:19  <jimpo> So for example, in a world with MAST, you might want to find all txs with a particular script redeem clause
119 2018-03-16T02:27:29  <sipa> mhmm
120 2018-03-16T02:27:54  <sipa> in a world with signature aggregation there may not be anything to match o
121 2018-03-16T02:28:08  <sipa> i'm not convinced that's useful in the long term
122 2018-03-16T02:28:31  <jimpo> with sig aggregation aren't all of the pubkeys published?
123 2018-03-16T02:28:32  <sipa> and in general, when there is, that in itself is sort of a sign that we're regealing too much information
124 2018-03-16T02:28:40  <sipa> *key aggregation
125 2018-03-16T02:28:48  <jimpo> I guess I'm not up to date on whether you are planning on using MuSig or Bellare-Neven
126 2018-03-16T02:29:00  <sipa> BN, but this is orthogonal
127 2018-03-16T02:29:15  <jimpo> With BN, individual pubkeys are published, right?
128 2018-03-16T02:29:29  <sipa> yes, but there would generally just be one per output
129 2018-03-16T02:29:41  <sipa> BN is used across the inputs of a tx
130 2018-03-16T02:29:42  <jimpo> and regardless of key/sig aggregation, the use case of scanning for MAST redeem clauses still stands
131 2018-03-16T02:29:53  <jimpo> no?
132 2018-03-16T02:30:07  <sipa> ideally there would not be something to match on
133 2018-03-16T02:30:45  <sipa> i do say ideally here - i see how it could be useful
134 2018-03-16T02:30:54  <jimpo> he's something concrete:
135 2018-03-16T02:31:05  <sipa> but in general we should aim for systems where all outputs and inouts are indistinguishable
136 2018-03-16T02:31:33  <sipa> so the only thing to match on would be an exact output script, or an input (based on outpoint) spending iy
137 2018-03-16T02:31:34  <jimpo> say lightning contracts are implemented with MAST and you want to find the ones that are redeemed with a particular hash preimage (for some reason)
138 2018-03-16T02:31:48  <sipa> sure, for now
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140 2018-03-16T02:32:12  <sipa> longer term i think we want to avoid having hash preimages?
141 2018-03-16T02:32:35  <sipa> i'm probably thinking further
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143 2018-03-16T02:36:13  <jimpo> Perhaps
144 2018-03-16T02:36:35  <sipa> i'm just a bit hesitant about committing to building a filter that only has uncertain use cases now, and is really only usable in situationd that are already undesirable
145 2018-03-16T02:36:47  <jimpo> Ultimately, this becomes philosophical: do we want to have more options to be future-proof or only support uses cases that we can think of today
146 2018-03-16T02:37:05  <sipa> hmm, i think it's the other way around
147 2018-03-16T02:37:12  <sipa> adding a filter is easy if necessary
148 2018-03-16T02:37:20  <jimpo> I don't have a strong preference as long as the basic filter is in
149 2018-03-16T02:37:32  <sipa> removing one is hard, if there is an ecosystem that unnecessarily relies on ot
150 2018-03-16T02:37:39  <sipa> *on it
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152 2018-03-16T02:38:07  <sipa> anyway, thanks for discussing it
153 2018-03-16T02:38:15  <sipa> and i'm looking forward to seeing some numbers
154 2018-03-16T02:39:12  * sipa afk
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196 2018-03-16T05:56:22  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] bitkevin opened pull request #12704: base58: use map instead of strchr() when decode (master...b58_bitmap) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/12704
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211 2018-03-16T07:40:13  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] kallewoof opened pull request #12705: Importmulti private key support (master...importmulti-wif-support) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/12705
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214 2018-03-16T08:05:29  <stevenroose> Is there a limit on the number of outputs in a tx?
215 2018-03-16T08:05:57  <stevenroose> it's just uint32, I guess? so no
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230 2018-03-16T08:45:36  <pyericz> the more outputs in a tx, the more fees you have to pay
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235 2018-03-16T09:00:55  <eklitzke> good luck fitting (1<<32) tx in a singe block
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237 2018-03-16T09:06:01  <kallewoof> output, not tx, but yeah... 0.0002328306 bytes per output (excluding other tx content). need some rad compression to pull that off.
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259 2018-03-16T10:06:13  <karelb> Where do translations lie in bitcoin core source code?
260 2018-03-16T10:07:03  <karelb> Oh, here?
261 2018-03-16T10:07:03  <karelb> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/tree/master/src/qt/locale
262 2018-03-16T10:09:10  <karelb> @spudowiar (not here now) had an idea - that it would be good to separate RPC documentation from the code, so things like https://github.com/bitcoin-core/bitcoincore.org/pull/526 could be generated (and fixed) more easily. I was thinking which format is best
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265 2018-03-16T10:12:30  <karelb> since once you separate it into a format, you need to parse that :) if it isn't a C code
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276 2018-03-16T11:35:39  <rex_4539> karelb Translations are in https://www.transifex.com/bitcoin
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335 2018-03-16T13:41:35  <ossifrage> Has anyone shone interest in changing outbound rate limit works from a bytes/time interval to something a bit smoother?
336 2018-03-16T13:42:28  <ossifrage> I added the ability to specify the nMaxOutboundLimit on the command line and I use a 1 hour limit vs the default of 24hrs
337 2018-03-16T13:45:00  <ossifrage> But I still get these spikes where bitcoind will saturate my gbit connection until it consumes the 1 hour limit
338 2018-03-16T13:45:47  <ossifrage> I could rate limit at the firewall, but I don't want to slow down normal usage, just serving old blocks
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356 2018-03-16T14:39:25  <hkjn0> hm, when building on armv7l, I a) build depends, b) do ./configure with --prefix set to depends/<arch>, c) make, this works fine, but unexpectedly leads 'make install' to put bins and libs in that prefix
357 2018-03-16T14:39:45  <hkjn0> i.e instead of bitcoind being installed in /usr/local/bin, I get: 'libtool: install: /usr/bin/install -c bitcoind /usr/local/src/bitcoin/depends/armv7l-unknown-linux-gnueabihf/bin/bitcoind'
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359 2018-03-16T14:42:08  <hkjn0> I found https://cmake.org/cmake/help/v3.0/variable/CMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX.html which looked promising, but doesn't quite do it: 'libtool: install: /usr/bin/install -c bitcoind /usr/local/bin/usr/local/src/bitcoin/depends/armv7l-unknown-linux-gnueabihf/bin/bitcoind'
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363 2018-03-16T15:12:20  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] practicalswift opened pull request #12707: log: Be less confusing in the way we inform the user that logging has started (master...scrolling-can-be-fun-but-this-is-too-much-fun) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/12707
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435 2018-03-16T16:37:11  <Guest39> ping
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469 2018-03-16T17:25:38  <arubi> hkjn0, you need to use --exec-prefix to set the install directory
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471 2018-03-16T17:28:54  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] sipa opened pull request #12708: Make verify-commits.sh test that merges are clean (master...201803_cleanmerge) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/12708
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479 2018-03-16T17:46:53  <hkjn0> arubi: oh, so ./configure with both --prefix and --exec-prefix? thanks, will give it a try
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502 2018-03-16T18:36:25  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] instagibbs opened pull request #12709: shuffle sendmany recipients ordering, since caller cannot control (master...shuffleoutputs) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/12709
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524 2018-03-16T20:19:22  <provoostenator> Alright, I went through the list of open Github tickets today. Hopefully helped a few get closed soon, but I may also have awakened a dragon or two.
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529 2018-03-16T20:32:00  <jimpo> That's epic, provoostenator. Thanks!
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558 2018-03-16T22:04:48  <Randolf> provoostenator:  Dragons waking up now?  Excellent, for cryptocurrencies need more dragons to scare the troublemakers away.  :)
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606 2018-03-16T23:59:54  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] sipa pushed 2 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/7be9a9a570c1...af20f9b1d485
607 2018-03-16T23:59:54  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 7ef46d0 practicalswift: Remove redundant includes. Conform to header include guidelines....
608 2018-03-16T23:59:55  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master af20f9b Pieter Wuille: Merge #12542: Remove redundant includes. Conform to header include guidelines....