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 233 2017-11-09T11:18:57  <luke-jr> I wonder if split HD should have had a 3rd category for refund addresses :x
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 235 2017-11-09T11:31:04  *** Khunbish has quit IRC
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 240 2017-11-09T12:13:29  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 2 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/f7388e93d3dd...b5f9f025fef0
 241 2017-11-09T12:13:29  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master bc9c0a7 Russell Yanofsky: Improve wallet-accounts test...
 242 2017-11-09T12:13:30  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master b5f9f02 Wladimir J. van der Laan: Merge #11552: Improve wallet-accounts test...
 243 2017-11-09T12:14:01  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj closed pull request #11552: Improve wallet-accounts test (master...pr/acctt) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11552
 244 2017-11-09T12:16:29  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 2 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/b5f9f025fef0...0dec4cc30044
 245 2017-11-09T12:16:29  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 9db9d62 gnuser: Refactor: make the read function simpler
 246 2017-11-09T12:16:30  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 0dec4cc Wladimir J. van der Laan: Merge #11221: Refactor: simpler read...
 247 2017-11-09T12:16:51  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj closed pull request #11221: Refactor: simpler read (master...refactor-streams) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11221
 248 2017-11-09T12:17:29  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 2 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/0dec4cc30044...331352f99f23
 249 2017-11-09T12:17:29  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 16be7dd Florian Schmaus: Improve bitcoind systemd service file...
 250 2017-11-09T12:17:29  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 331352f Wladimir J. van der Laan: Merge #10529: Improve bitcoind systemd service file...
 251 2017-11-09T12:17:43  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj closed pull request #10529: Improve bitcoind systemd service file (master...systemd-service) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/10529
 252 2017-11-09T12:17:46  *** bsm117532 has quit IRC
 253 2017-11-09T12:33:07  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 3 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/331352f99f23...0ecc6305f464
 254 2017-11-09T12:33:08  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master b411c2a João Barbosa: Improve -disablewallet parameter interaction
 255 2017-11-09T12:33:08  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 7963335 João Barbosa: Fix -disablewallet default value
 256 2017-11-09T12:33:09  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 0ecc630 Wladimir J. van der Laan: Merge #11594: Improve -disablewallet parameter interaction...
 257 2017-11-09T12:33:35  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj closed pull request #11594: Improve -disablewallet parameter interaction (master...2017-11-disable-wallet) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11594
 258 2017-11-09T12:34:33  *** adetate has quit IRC
 259 2017-11-09T12:39:17  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 2 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/0ecc6305f464...ef3758d1ef73
 260 2017-11-09T12:39:17  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master b109a1c practicalswift: Remove redundant nullptr checks before deallocation...
 261 2017-11-09T12:39:18  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master ef3758d Wladimir J. van der Laan: Merge #10696: Remove redundant nullptr checks before deallocation...
 262 2017-11-09T12:39:31  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj closed pull request #10696: Remove redundant nullptr checks before deallocation (master...delete-nullptr) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/10696
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 265 2017-11-09T12:49:10  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj closed pull request #9716: [Net] Clarity TIMEOUT_INTERVAL constant meaning. (master...2017-02-07-ping-timeout-interval) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/9716
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 269 2017-11-09T13:15:19  *** wxss_ is now known as wxss
 270 2017-11-09T13:19:28  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj closed pull request #10890: libbitcoinconsensus: Add version field to pkg-config info file (master...master) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/10890
 271 2017-11-09T13:23:51  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 2 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/ef3758d1ef73...77ba4bf960d3
 272 2017-11-09T13:23:51  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 5a5e4e9 Karl-Johan Alm: [wallet] Remove CTransaction&() helper conversion operator from wallet implementation.
 273 2017-11-09T13:23:52  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 77ba4bf Wladimir J. van der Laan: Merge #10368: [wallet] Remove helper conversion operator from wallet...
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 275 2017-11-09T13:24:01  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj closed pull request #10368: [wallet] Remove helper conversion operator from wallet (master...wallet-refactor-remove-ctrans-helper) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/10368
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 283 2017-11-09T14:20:42  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 2 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/77ba4bf960d3...99ec12666ba7
 284 2017-11-09T14:20:42  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 6c4042a Eelis: Assert that CWallet::SyncMetaData finds oldest transaction....
 285 2017-11-09T14:20:43  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 99ec126 Wladimir J. van der Laan: Merge #11074: Assert that CWallet::SyncMetaData finds oldest transaction....
 286 2017-11-09T14:21:08  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj closed pull request #11074: Assert that CWallet::SyncMetaData finds oldest transaction. (master...syncassert) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11074
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 295 2017-11-09T14:41:55  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] morcos closed pull request #9447: Allow 2 simultaneous block downloads (master...doubledownload) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/9447
 296 2017-11-09T14:42:12  <Drakon_> I'd like to provide a (feature) suggestion. Should I address at #bitcoin in order to do so?
 297 2017-11-09T14:43:31  <luke-jr> sounds like a good place to start
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 299 2017-11-09T14:45:44  <wumpus> yes, this is not the place for feature suggestions, unless you're planning to implement it yourself and having questions about how to do so
 300 2017-11-09T14:51:38  <Drakon_> This isn't my current intention, at least not at the moment. So where to address my suggestion?
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 303 2017-11-09T14:54:33  <wumpus> #bitcoin as suggested
 304 2017-11-09T14:57:26  <Drakon_> Well sorry, but I'm a little bit confuse since you wrote "this is not the place for feature suggestions ..."
 305 2017-11-09T14:58:17  <luke-jr> this isn't #bitcoin
 306 2017-11-09T14:58:46  <Drakon_> Well sorry, I messed this up.
 307 2017-11-09T15:02:21  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] BitonicEelis opened pull request #11643: Remove dead store in secp256k1_ecmult_gen. (master...deadstore) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11643
 308 2017-11-09T15:07:31  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] fanquake closed pull request #11643: Remove dead store in secp256k1_ecmult_gen. (master...deadstore) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11643
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 311 2017-11-09T15:34:41  <BlueMatt> cfields: re: #11562: I believe using high_resolution_clock is incorrect - seems like high_resolution_clock::is_steady is rarely true
 312 2017-11-09T15:34:43  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/11562 | bench: use std::chrono rather than gettimeofday by theuni · Pull Request #11562 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
 313 2017-11-09T15:35:11  <BlueMatt> I mean or we can do something like this: https://gist.github.com/kballard/3549291#file-benchmark-hpp-L8
 314 2017-11-09T15:37:51  <BlueMatt> cfields: we should be preferring steady_clock over high_resolution, I think, and then we can static_assert something about the resolution being at least microsecond or so...
 315 2017-11-09T15:39:12  <BlueMatt> also, master dont build, yo
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 317 2017-11-09T15:43:46  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] TheBlueMatt opened pull request #11644: Fix qt build broken by 5a5e4e9 (master...2017-11-fix-build) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11644
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 322 2017-11-09T15:58:48  <wumpus> BlueMatt: I also commented about that on the original PR
 323 2017-11-09T15:59:09  <wumpus> apparently the steady clock is usually the same resolution as the high resolution clock
 324 2017-11-09T16:00:08  <wumpus> this just handles the rare case where the high resolution clock is higher resolution (but not steady) in which case a higher resolution is probably preferred
 325 2017-11-09T16:00:12  <BlueMatt> wumpus: indeed, but it seems nonsense to prefer high_resolution over steady *unless* their resolution is the same
 326 2017-11-09T16:00:26  <BlueMatt> really? I mean its not like any of our runs require *that* much precision
 327 2017-11-09T16:00:36  <wumpus> I don't think I agree on that, for benchmarks precision is always preferred
 328 2017-11-09T16:00:43  <BlueMatt> microsecond is more than enough, even millisecond is probably fine especially after the next pr
 329 2017-11-09T16:01:13  <wumpus> I mean the difference is that the steady clock isn't affected by time changes, but those should be rare anyhow right?
 330 2017-11-09T16:01:27  <BlueMatt> but precision is nonsense if you're running ntp - the chance that your clock is running fast/slow randomly is not 0 and the gain you get from microsecond to something smaller is ~0
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 332 2017-11-09T16:02:16  <wumpus> running benchmarks on a system where the time is jumping crazy around sounds like a stupid idea to me
 333 2017-11-09T16:02:35  <BlueMatt> most systems have ntpd, though....
 334 2017-11-09T16:02:43  <BlueMatt> I think its like built-in to systemd or some batshit insane shit now
 335 2017-11-09T16:02:45  <wumpus> ntp is supposed to increase time precision, not decrease it
 336 2017-11-09T16:03:25  <wumpus> e.g. it explicitly doesn't do any large sudden corrections
 337 2017-11-09T16:03:53  <BlueMatt> but it does corrections by making your clock run fast/slow when it detects your clock to be off (or your network path to have changed.....)
 338 2017-11-09T16:04:04  <wumpus> that's the point, yes
 339 2017-11-09T16:04:52  <MarcoFalke> I read that as a point for the steady_clock
 340 2017-11-09T16:05:14  <Victorsueca> Came here to say it, but seems like you already noticed master is failing a lot lately
 341 2017-11-09T16:05:35  <wumpus> Victorsueca: a lot?
 342 2017-11-09T16:05:44  <BlueMatt> Victorsueca: usually master travis failures are cause travis will cancel a job if you push something new on top of it, so github shows them as failed
 343 2017-11-09T16:05:51  <MarcoFalke> what do you mean? The tests?
 344 2017-11-09T16:05:54  <BlueMatt> though master is actually failing right now, but its the first I've seen that in months
 345 2017-11-09T16:05:57  <wumpus> these kind of merge conficts are incredibly rare
 346 2017-11-09T16:06:11  <Victorsueca> BlueMatt: ahh that explains it
 347 2017-11-09T16:06:13  <wumpus> currently testing BlueMatt's change
 348 2017-11-09T16:06:49  <sipa> far better to have it fail to compile/test than have bugs
 349 2017-11-09T16:07:01  <BlueMatt> Victorsueca: I often restart them cause I'm super ocd, though I should probably stop doing that cause it stops testing other things......
 350 2017-11-09T16:07:15  <wumpus> absolutely
 351 2017-11-09T16:08:21  <MarcoFalke> I mean we have a backlog anyway and that motivates people to compile and run locally
 352 2017-11-09T16:08:30  <MarcoFalke> So I don't see huge issues with that
 353 2017-11-09T16:08:34  <BlueMatt> yea, we almost always have a backlog during business hours :/
 354 2017-11-09T16:08:43  * BlueMatt works on weekends, suckers :p
 355 2017-11-09T16:10:28  <BlueMatt> wumpus: eg https://github.com/coreos/bugs/issues/391 which talks about how, yet again, systemd be breaking shit, in this case cause its timesyncd (which will now be default, I guess, on most hosts) is not accurate enough for ceph
 356 2017-11-09T16:10:46  <wumpus> BlueMatt: yes thinking about it some more I agree with you
 357 2017-11-09T16:10:57  <BlueMatt> given steady_clock usually has very good precision and the point of benchmarks is usually to figure out if things changed from one commit to another, not to compare between hosts, I think we should prefer that
 358 2017-11-09T16:13:51  <wumpus> yes, indeed
 359 2017-11-09T16:14:07  <BlueMatt> k, willfix
 360 2017-11-09T16:14:29  <wumpus> it also simplifies the code if we always use the same clock
 361 2017-11-09T16:15:21  *** JackH has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
 362 2017-11-09T16:17:34  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 2 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/99ec12666ba7...045a80923419
 363 2017-11-09T16:17:34  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 9e9e31a Matt Corallo: Fix qt build broken by 5a5e4e9
 364 2017-11-09T16:17:34  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 045a809 Wladimir J. van der Laan: Merge #11644: Fix qt build broken by 5a5e4e9...
 365 2017-11-09T16:18:08  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj closed pull request #11644: Fix qt build broken by 5a5e4e9 (master...2017-11-fix-build) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11644
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 376 2017-11-09T16:50:14  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] TheBlueMatt opened pull request #11646: Require a steady clock for bench with at least micro precision (master...2017-11-11562-cleanups) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11646
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 385 2017-11-09T17:12:19  <BlueMatt> wumpus: hmmm, re: #11583 I kinda feel yucky adding a BCLog category that just means "ALWAYS log" - would you be ok with a #define function which does the LogPrint/LogPrintf call based on pnode->fInbound?
 386 2017-11-09T17:12:20  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/11583 | Do not make it trivial for inbound peers to generate log entries by TheBlueMatt · Pull Request #11583 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
 387 2017-11-09T17:13:45  <wumpus> BlueMatt: I kind of like the idea of having a always-log category
 388 2017-11-09T17:14:08  <wumpus> BlueMatt: it means LogPrintf could be defined in terms of it, and at some point only one log function would be needed anymore
 389 2017-11-09T17:14:35  <wumpus> myself I always get confused between Logprint and Logprintf also because they are named so similarly
 390 2017-11-09T17:14:44  <BlueMatt> true.....
 391 2017-11-09T17:14:57  <BlueMatt> man i hate having a one-of-these-things-is-not-like-the-other enum :(
 392 2017-11-09T17:15:05  *** BashCo has quit IRC
 393 2017-11-09T17:15:14  <wumpus> well there is already a ::ALL
 394 2017-11-09T17:15:38  <BlueMatt> yea, but at least thats just defined to ~0
 395 2017-11-09T17:15:40  <wumpus> maybe we could use that as "log always"?
 396 2017-11-09T17:16:16  <wumpus> it doesn't really matter what it's defined to, just how it's handled :)
 397 2017-11-09T17:16:19  <BlueMatt> hmmmm, I thought about that briefly but decided I prefer an ::ALWAYS cause then you're even more confused....-debug=0 means ~0 still logs?
 398 2017-11-09T17:16:30  <BlueMatt> even though ~0 & 1 doesnt?
 399 2017-11-09T17:16:38  <BlueMatt> errr, ~0 ^ 1
 400 2017-11-09T17:16:48  <wumpus> hrm yeah
 401 2017-11-09T17:17:10  <wumpus> can't we just move those messages always to ::NET :-)
 402 2017-11-09T17:17:11  <BlueMatt> alright, I'll take a dive down the ::ALWAYS rabbit hole and see where I end up
 403 2017-11-09T17:17:19  <wumpus> that would remove this entire issue
 404 2017-11-09T17:17:36  <BlueMatt> I mean its nice to know when your outbound peers succeed in connecting
 405 2017-11-09T17:17:37  <wumpus> I mean they *are* net messages
 406 2017-11-09T17:17:41  <BlueMatt> I could add a second log for that
 407 2017-11-09T17:17:50  <wumpus> yes
 408 2017-11-09T17:17:53  <wumpus> maybe that's better
 409 2017-11-09T17:18:01  <BlueMatt> ok, fine, will table the ::ALWAYS discussion
 410 2017-11-09T17:18:11  *** jb55 has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
 411 2017-11-09T17:19:04  <wumpus> the root issue really is that we confound log class and log priority
 412 2017-11-09T17:19:36  <wumpus> but I don't think we need to make logging perfect before merging your PR :)
 413 2017-11-09T17:21:39  <wumpus> but I agree with you that BCLog::ALWAYS is ugly
 414 2017-11-09T17:22:08  <wumpus> would prefer to add BCLog::ERROR BCLog::WARNING BCLog::DEBUG
 415 2017-11-09T17:22:47  <wumpus> then the log system would show messages based on a threshold
 416 2017-11-09T17:23:10  <wumpus> and it's not decided at the site of logigng whether something should always show
 417 2017-11-09T17:23:23  <BlueMatt> I mean I dunno, I kinda like the idea of logging based on subsystem, especially with rpc to turn them on and off - it lets you debug just the subsystem that is acting up
 418 2017-11-09T17:23:34  <wumpus> the subsystem should certainly stay
 419 2017-11-09T17:23:34  <BlueMatt> we could add both
 420 2017-11-09T17:23:36  * BlueMatt ducks
 421 2017-11-09T17:23:57  <wumpus> common is to have a combination of both
 422 2017-11-09T17:24:08  <BlueMatt> that sounds overcomplex
 423 2017-11-09T17:24:13  <BlueMatt> but, eh...whatever
 424 2017-11-09T17:24:23  <wumpus> it's pretty much how it's done in all software
 425 2017-11-09T17:24:24  <BlueMatt> a discussion for when someone actually goes and writes the code to change it :p
 426 2017-11-09T17:24:32  <wumpus> so you can select by category or by priority
 427 2017-11-09T17:25:10  <wumpus> so this would be either a low priority or high priority net message based on incoming/outgoing
 428 2017-11-09T17:26:40  <wumpus> it also means that the log output can show the category, so you can grep for it later
 429 2017-11-09T17:30:08  *** laurentmt has quit IRC
 430 2017-11-09T17:31:04  <wumpus> (because all log messages will have a category, not just the debug priority ones)
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 444 2017-11-09T18:29:48  <cfields> BlueMatt / wumpus: after thinking on it a bit, i agree with the clock change.
 445 2017-11-09T18:35:06  *** ExtraCrispy has quit IRC
 446 2017-11-09T18:35:54  *** bule has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
 447 2017-11-09T18:41:28  <wumpus> cfields: awesome
 448 2017-11-09T18:45:06  <Chris_Stewart_5> meeting in 15 right?
 449 2017-11-09T18:45:23  *** jb55 has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
 450 2017-11-09T18:46:56  <wumpus> yes
 451 2017-11-09T18:51:57  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke pushed 5 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/045a80923419...5e3f5e4f25b6
 452 2017-11-09T18:51:58  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 2904e30 John Newbery: [tests] Remove dead code from mininode.py...
 453 2017-11-09T18:51:58  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master c0b1274 John Newbery: [tests] Remove support for bre-BIP31 ping messages...
 454 2017-11-09T18:51:59  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 3858aab John Newbery: [tests] Remove support for p2p alert messages...
 455 2017-11-09T18:52:27  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke closed pull request #11638: [tests] Dead mininode code (master...dead_mininode_code) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11638
 456 2017-11-09T18:55:05  *** meshcollider has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
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 458 2017-11-09T18:57:27  <promag> hi
 459 2017-11-09T18:57:45  <jonasschnelli> o/
 460 2017-11-09T18:58:27  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 3 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/5e3f5e4f25b6...1f4375f8e75f
 461 2017-11-09T18:58:28  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 3788a84 Matt Corallo: Do not send (potentially) invalid headers in response to getheaders...
 462 2017-11-09T18:58:28  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 725b79a Russell Yanofsky: [test] Verify node doesn't send headers that haven't been fully validated
 463 2017-11-09T18:58:29  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 1f4375f Wladimir J. van der Laan: Merge #11580: Do not send (potentially) invalid headers in response to getheaders...
 464 2017-11-09T18:58:53  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj closed pull request #11580: Do not send (potentially) invalid headers in response to getheaders (master...2017-10-getheaders-valid-only) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11580
 465 2017-11-09T19:01:20  <sipa> meetung?
 466 2017-11-09T19:01:30  <jonasschnelli> jup
 467 2017-11-09T19:01:35  <achow101> meeting
 468 2017-11-09T19:02:18  <wumpus> #startmeeting
 469 2017-11-09T19:02:18  <lightningbot> Meeting started Thu Nov  9 19:02:18 2017 UTC.  The chair is wumpus. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
 470 2017-11-09T19:02:18  <lightningbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
 471 2017-11-09T19:02:21  <MarcoFalke> proposed short topic "Signing key for gitian executables"
 472 2017-11-09T19:02:27  <meshcollider> Hi
 473 2017-11-09T19:02:31  <achow101> hi
 474 2017-11-09T19:02:34  <wumpus> #bitcoin-core-dev Meeting: wumpus sipa gmaxwell jonasschnelli morcos luke-jr btcdrak sdaftuar jtimon cfields petertodd kanzure bluematt instagibbs phantomcircuit codeshark michagogo marcofalke paveljanik NicolasDorier jl2012 achow101 meshcollider jnewbery maaku fanquake promag
 475 2017-11-09T19:02:34  <Provoostenator> Hi
 476 2017-11-09T19:02:42  <sdaftuar> oh hi
 477 2017-11-09T19:02:50  <cfields> hi
 478 2017-11-09T19:02:52  <morcos> hi
 479 2017-11-09T19:03:04  <wumpus> #topic 0.15.1
 480 2017-11-09T19:03:05  <instagibbs> hi
 481 2017-11-09T19:03:13  <morcos> Release!
 482 2017-11-09T19:03:15  <sdaftuar> does it work?
 483 2017-11-09T19:03:15  <wumpus> anyone had any bug reports regarding the rc?
 484 2017-11-09T19:03:22  <BlueMatt> Release!
 485 2017-11-09T19:03:25  <instagibbs> I have not seen any...
 486 2017-11-09T19:03:33  <MarcoFalke> release notes missing?
 487 2017-11-09T19:03:36  *** promag has quit IRC
 488 2017-11-09T19:03:38  <wumpus> seems that was a short rc cycle then
 489 2017-11-09T19:03:43  <achow101> I haven't seen any, but I also don't know how many people are testing it out
 490 2017-11-09T19:03:50  <sipa> yes, i think we need a writeup on the P2P changes at least
 491 2017-11-09T19:03:50  <wumpus> MarcoFalke: no? I think we have them?
 492 2017-11-09T19:03:57  <meshcollider> MarcoFalke I wrote release notes and wumpus already merged
 493 2017-11-09T19:04:02  *** promag has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
 494 2017-11-09T19:04:03  <MarcoFalke> great
 495 2017-11-09T19:04:09  <MarcoFalke> Tag and release?
 496 2017-11-09T19:04:16  <BlueMatt> there's no release notes on the p2p changes, I think
 497 2017-11-09T19:04:18  <BlueMatt> as sipa points out
 498 2017-11-09T19:04:21  <sdaftuar> yes there are some
 499 2017-11-09T19:04:22  <morcos> yeah i think actually we might as well not release yet, there is no big rush now, so might as well see if any bugs pop up?
 500 2017-11-09T19:04:22  <BlueMatt> though that may be fine
 501 2017-11-09T19:04:28  <cfields> i suspect many of the people who might've usually been testing rc1 got stuck dealing with drama instead :(
 502 2017-11-09T19:04:32  <wumpus> I don't think we should hold up a minor on release notes tbh, unless something really important is missing\
 503 2017-11-09T19:05:21  <luke-jr> morcos: I'm not sure we should drop our guard so easily
 504 2017-11-09T19:05:23  <achow101> morcos: there's still a possibility that some miner goes ahead and forks anyways
 505 2017-11-09T19:05:28  <BlueMatt> we can tag an rc2 with no changes to encourage testing :p
 506 2017-11-09T19:05:29  <wumpus> if it's ready we should just release and move on
 507 2017-11-09T19:05:38  <achow101> like these guys: https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-segwit2x/2017-November/000689.html
 508 2017-11-09T19:05:39  <BlueMatt> but, yea, I think we should release
 509 2017-11-09T19:05:42  <jonasschnelli> ack
 510 2017-11-09T19:05:44  <meshcollider> Hmm did I miss something? I thought I wrote up
 511 2017-11-09T19:05:52  <BlueMatt> even the idiots running a few hundred btc1 nodes may cause disruption and 15.1 can help
 512 2017-11-09T19:05:55  <luke-jr> achow101: in fact, at least one mining pool has announced they intend to
 513 2017-11-09T19:06:09  <meshcollider> ACK on release though, can just do if it's got a bug ;)
 514 2017-11-09T19:06:13  <sdaftuar> lol
 515 2017-11-09T19:06:15  <wumpus> yes would be a waste if we get disruption anyway
 516 2017-11-09T19:06:20  <BlueMatt> meshcollider: god damn it
 517 2017-11-09T19:06:23  <wumpus> because some people fork anyway
 518 2017-11-09T19:06:24  <sipa> meshcollider: oh, i missed those notes!
 519 2017-11-09T19:06:37  <Provoostenator> This being Bitcoin, _someone_ is going to fork...
 520 2017-11-09T19:06:38  * BlueMatt proposes from here on out all version numbers must be majorversion.some.series.of.0s.and.1s :p
 521 2017-11-09T19:06:41  <wumpus> and we have a release ready but decide to delay it because 'no rush'
 522 2017-11-09T19:06:42  <morcos> ok ok..  i have no problem releasing
 523 2017-11-09T19:06:50  <luke-jr> meshcollider: if we make 0.15.2 another bugfix-only, we can do segwit wallet in 0.15.pi
 524 2017-11-09T19:06:55  <sdaftuar> release!
 525 2017-11-09T19:06:59  <kanzure> hi.
 526 2017-11-09T19:06:59  <wumpus> ok!
 527 2017-11-09T19:07:01  <BlueMatt> Relese!
 528 2017-11-09T19:07:04  <BlueMatt> e
 529 2017-11-09T19:07:08  <wumpus> #action release 0.15.1
 530 2017-11-09T19:07:11  <achow101> ack release
 531 2017-11-09T19:07:18  <wumpus> #topic HIgh priority for review
 532 2017-11-09T19:07:32  <wumpus> I think https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/projects/8 is stale now
 533 2017-11-09T19:07:55  *** BashCo has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
 534 2017-11-09T19:08:02  <achow101> so back to doing segwit wallet stuff?
 535 2017-11-09T19:08:07  *** Deacydal has quit IRC
 536 2017-11-09T19:08:07  <wumpus> the blockers were those that were already there before we started working on 0.15.1, so probably needs a update
 537 2017-11-09T19:08:14  <wumpus> achow101: yes
 538 2017-11-09T19:08:25  <wumpus> we should at least have segwit wallet in 0.16.0
 539 2017-11-09T19:08:34  *** Deacydal has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
 540 2017-11-09T19:08:40  <sipa> yes
 541 2017-11-09T19:08:49  <jonasschnelli> Yes. SW wallet support should be in projects/8
 542 2017-11-09T19:08:54  <morcos> sipa: did you ever write up that document?
 543 2017-11-09T19:08:54  <meshcollider> C.f. #11403
 544 2017-11-09T19:08:57  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/11403 | SegWit wallet support by sipa · Pull Request #11403 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
 545 2017-11-09T19:08:57  <BlueMatt> speaking of segwit wallet......sipa where are we?
 546 2017-11-09T19:09:01  <sipa> no, sorry, distracted
 547 2017-11-09T19:09:07  <sipa> been thinking a lot about it though...
 548 2017-11-09T19:09:12  <morcos> i don't think i had any concerns about the last plan as i understood it.. but would be nice to sort of have it written out
 549 2017-11-09T19:09:22  <wumpus> added
 550 2017-11-09T19:09:26  <sipa> agree, i'll try to write things up today
 551 2017-11-09T19:09:49  <morcos> have we decided that barring bugs, the next release will be 0.16 with segwit wallet?
 552 2017-11-09T19:09:51  <achow101> is 11403 all that's left for segwit wallet? (besides the fact that it is the segwit wallet PR)
 553 2017-11-09T19:10:01  <morcos> and then the new and improved segwit wallet will be left for 0.1&?
 554 2017-11-09T19:10:04  <morcos> 0.17
 555 2017-11-09T19:10:05  <sipa> achow101: there are some TODOs left
 556 2017-11-09T19:10:20  <wumpus> morcos: I think that's sensible
 557 2017-11-09T19:10:21  <sipa> morcos: i'm going to stop thinking in terms of specific releases
 558 2017-11-09T19:10:25  <jonasschnelli> morcos: makes sense
 559 2017-11-09T19:10:31  * BlueMatt was concerned about the approach but there's lots of tradeoffs, so really wanted to see the aforementioned doc
 560 2017-11-09T19:10:32  <wumpus> just do an early 0.16 release if it's finished early
 561 2017-11-09T19:10:47  <sipa> but short term, 11403 + its todos
 562 2017-11-09T19:10:52  <morcos> wumpus: yes thats what i mean.. ok good.
 563 2017-11-09T19:10:52  <wumpus> I'm kind of tired of holding off changes because backports to 0.15 need to be easier
 564 2017-11-09T19:10:55  <sipa> long term, rework ismine etc
 565 2017-11-09T19:11:08  <sipa> and release whatever is ready
 566 2017-11-09T19:11:32  <MarcoFalke> wumpus: Are we still doing a 0.15 with segwit wallet?
 567 2017-11-09T19:11:49  <wumpus> MarcoFalke: no, I don't think so (or at least that's what we discussed last meeting)
 568 2017-11-09T19:11:52  <cfields> ack 0.16 whenever segwit wallet is ready
 569 2017-11-09T19:11:56  <promag> sorry, multi wallet also for 0.16?
 570 2017-11-09T19:12:04  <sipa> multiwallet is in 0.15, no?
 571 2017-11-09T19:12:09  <meshcollider> Dynamic multiwallet?
 572 2017-11-09T19:12:11  <jonasschnelli> promag: if it's ready... you mean dynamic loading/unloading?
 573 2017-11-09T19:12:17  <promag> yes
 574 2017-11-09T19:12:24  <luke-jr> MarcoFalke: same plan, different versioning
 575 2017-11-09T19:12:25  <wumpus> if it's ready in time, sure
 576 2017-11-09T19:12:26  <jonasschnelli> promag: Should be possible
 577 2017-11-09T19:12:36  <wumpus> not going to hold it up on that though, if the explicit goal is segwit wallet
 578 2017-11-09T19:12:44  <promag> not project 8 thou?
 579 2017-11-09T19:12:49  <jonasschnelli> Indeed
 580 2017-11-09T19:12:54  <jonasschnelli> promag: it is there
 581 2017-11-09T19:13:02  <MarcoFalke> #action put segwit wallet in the next major release
 582 2017-11-09T19:13:21  <wumpus> yes, anything else for high priority for review?
 583 2017-11-09T19:13:44  <BlueMatt> #10286 :(
 584 2017-11-09T19:13:48  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/10286 | Call wallet notify callbacks in scheduler thread (without cs_main) by TheBlueMatt · Pull Request #10286 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
 585 2017-11-09T19:13:56  <jonasschnelli> I'd like to see BIP159 in 0.16... but it's already in the HP list
 586 2017-11-09T19:14:09  <BlueMatt> jonasschnelli: needs rebase and I left you comments :p
 587 2017-11-09T19:14:14  <wumpus> 10286 is already on there
 588 2017-11-09T19:14:34  <meshcollider> Any label stuff to replace accounts in there?
 589 2017-11-09T19:14:35  <sipa> bip159 would be nice, indeed
 590 2017-11-09T19:14:37  <jonasschnelli> BlueMatt: yes. Saw that.. will work on it asap
 591 2017-11-09T19:14:56  * jonasschnelli has 14.4k connection this week
 592 2017-11-09T19:15:22  <promag> btw, I think it would be cool to have some diagram of the current thread model and what should be the ideal model
 593 2017-11-09T19:15:36  <wumpus> thread model?
 594 2017-11-09T19:15:39  <promag> I think BlueMatt has some things in mind
 595 2017-11-09T19:15:57  <jonasschnelli> I think promag means the general concurrency concept, right?
 596 2017-11-09T19:16:04  <promag> sure
 597 2017-11-09T19:16:25  <BlueMatt> promag: my model is CValidationInterface
 598 2017-11-09T19:16:26  <BlueMatt> :p
 599 2017-11-09T19:16:32  <promag> well BlueMatt keeps saying he wants to refactor in some way, but would be cool to actually "see" the big picture
 600 2017-11-09T19:16:37  <jonasschnelli> We move away from topics... MarcoFalke had a proposed topic
 601 2017-11-09T19:16:43  <BlueMatt> promag: CValidationInterface :p
 602 2017-11-09T19:16:57  <meshcollider> Signing keys for binaries?
 603 2017-11-09T19:16:58  <morcos> promag: +1
 604 2017-11-09T19:17:32  <jonasschnelli> [09:02:17]  <MarcoFalke>	proposed short topic "Signing key for gitian executables"
 605 2017-11-09T19:17:38  <wumpus> #topic Signing key for gitian executables (MarcoFalke)
 606 2017-11-09T19:17:43  <MarcoFalke> Background is that the current key expires Q1 2018, so we should come up with something for the 0.16 release. Someone had the idea to ask MIT to apply for a key, as individuals can not apply AFAICT.
 607 2017-11-09T19:17:49  <jonasschnelli> can you elaborate MarcoFalke?
 608 2017-11-09T19:18:04  <jonasschnelli> MarcoFalke: you mean the Apple/WINDOWS code signing keys?
 609 2017-11-09T19:18:08  <BlueMatt> MarcoFalke: there was some discussion of doing a split rsa key here.... gmaxwell around?
 610 2017-11-09T19:18:12  <MarcoFalke> jonasschnelli: jup
 611 2017-11-09T19:18:13  <luke-jr> would be good to have a key that is explicitly used for not only Core releases (eg, Knots too)
 612 2017-11-09T19:18:15  <jonasschnelli> Apple is still the Bitcoin Foundatiomn, right?
 613 2017-11-09T19:18:23  <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: I have code for mpc generation of rsa keys and signing.
 614 2017-11-09T19:18:24  <MarcoFalke> BlueMatt: That would require some more time?
 615 2017-11-09T19:18:30  <jonasschnelli> luke-jr: no, only Core
 616 2017-11-09T19:18:34  <luke-jr> jonasschnelli: why?
 617 2017-11-09T19:18:41  <cfields> yes, both are btcf atm
 618 2017-11-09T19:18:42  <BlueMatt> luke-jr: no
 619 2017-11-09T19:18:49  <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: (by I have, I mean it's on github, and I've used it... works fine)
 620 2017-11-09T19:19:07  <jonasschnelli> luke-jr: its about trust... I don't know if I would sign something I havev't reviewd
 621 2017-11-09T19:19:31  <cfields> gmaxwell: deals well with csr? I have no idea if that complicates things.
 622 2017-11-09T19:19:55  <achow101> the windows cert expires in 2019
 623 2017-11-09T19:19:57  <jonasschnelli> MarcoFalke: individuals can apply for keys (Apple and Windows)
 624 2017-11-09T19:20:02  <jonasschnelli> But not sure if we should do individuals...
 625 2017-11-09T19:20:03  <instagibbs> jonasschnelli, mmm not sure if gitian is about you "trusting" the binary, so much as it matches others'?
 626 2017-11-09T19:20:06  <gmaxwell> cfields: it deals with RSA numbers, someone would need to do the hacking to stuff the rsa number it generates into a CSR and whatnot.
 627 2017-11-09T19:20:27  <cfields> gmaxwell: ok
 628 2017-11-09T19:20:48  <luke-jr> jonasschnelli: I see it as dealing with backward OS policies that make it hard for users to run stuff.
 629 2017-11-09T19:20:55  <morcos> Does anyone think its best to just get BTCF to renew for now?
 630 2017-11-09T19:21:02  <gmaxwell> I think it's _really_ unfortunate to have any name except the project name on the binaries, causes a drama and stupidity.  There are still people that think the bitcoin foundation controls bitcoin just because of that existing cert. :(
 631 2017-11-09T19:21:02  <wumpus> luke-jr: it basically is
 632 2017-11-09T19:21:02  <BlueMatt> todo: cfields creates an rsa # -> csr program :p
 633 2017-11-09T19:21:12  <gmaxwell> morcos: thats the obvious thing to do.
 634 2017-11-09T19:21:18  <jonasschnelli> luke-jr: yes. But applying for you own key is maybe 300USD/year,.... so possible IMO
 635 2017-11-09T19:21:33  <BlueMatt> gmaxwell: so can I just legally change my name to Bitcoin Core, get a cert, and then change it back?
 636 2017-11-09T19:21:34  <BlueMatt> :p
 637 2017-11-09T19:21:40  <jonasschnelli> morcos: renaming with the APPLE Developer Portal is almost impossible
 638 2017-11-09T19:21:43  <achow101> BlueMatt: lol
 639 2017-11-09T19:21:45  <meshcollider> lol
 640 2017-11-09T19:21:57  <morcos> jonasschnelli: huh?
 641 2017-11-09T19:21:58  <jonasschnelli> changing name requires legal documents, etc.
 642 2017-11-09T19:22:03  <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: well the other option is that we just register a bitcoin core org someplace and have it get the key. But I wouldn't want to suggest that for a key that is expiring soon.
 643 2017-11-09T19:22:11  <jonasschnelli> It's all by approval basis through apple
 644 2017-11-09T19:22:16  <gmaxwell> it's not terribly hard, just requires a bit of money.
 645 2017-11-09T19:22:19  <jonasschnelli> you need a D.U.N.S number as well
 646 2017-11-09T19:22:21  <BlueMatt> I mean it doesnt take long to create an LLC that holds $0
 647 2017-11-09T19:22:34  <kanzure> would chaincode do it?
 648 2017-11-09T19:22:44  <jonasschnelli> But plase... don't set up an orga called "Bitcoin Core"
 649 2017-11-09T19:22:57  <meshcollider> Then bitcoin core really would be a company and you'd set off all the conspiracy theorists
 650 2017-11-09T19:22:57  <wumpus> jonasschnelli: agree
 651 2017-11-09T19:22:58  <gmaxwell> Bitcoin Core Code Signing Key inc.
 652 2017-11-09T19:22:58  <morcos> I'm happy to have an official Bitcoin Core org established if we want that, but it does seem like there are downsides to that
 653 2017-11-09T19:23:07  <wumpus> gmaxwell: yeah
 654 2017-11-09T19:23:12  <jonasschnelli> Id rather use an individual then ChainCodeLabs for it's own protection
 655 2017-11-09T19:23:13  <morcos> unless we specifically limited its purpose very narrowly
 656 2017-11-09T19:23:18  <cfields> ugh
 657 2017-11-09T19:23:23  <kanzure> yes if it's a "bitoin core org" then it should be named "bitcoin core code signing key holding only and nothing else, llc."
 658 2017-11-09T19:23:24  <luke-jr> wumpus: jonasschnelli: then I see no reason not to use a common key for both Core and Knots..
 659 2017-11-09T19:23:24  <wumpus> CoreSign
 660 2017-11-09T19:23:40  <jonasschnelli> I could provide my own personal APPL key...
 661 2017-11-09T19:23:43  * BlueMatt votes for someone to just create Bitcoin Core Code Signing, LLC
 662 2017-11-09T19:23:44  <gmaxwell> Bitcoin Release signing key incorporated.
 663 2017-11-09T19:23:46  <achow101> BTW the apple key expires Jan 11 2018, Windows March 5 2019, so we would need to do this soon
 664 2017-11-09T19:23:50  <morcos> luke-jr: stop..  please bring up knots later .  it has nothing to do with the Core meeting
 665 2017-11-09T19:23:56  <jonasschnelli> (OSX only)
 666 2017-11-09T19:24:11  <jonasschnelli> heh
 667 2017-11-09T19:24:17  <gmaxwell> achow101: or just renew the apple one then, and continue on with doing something sensible.
 668 2017-11-09T19:24:32  <cfields> ok, in parallel to whatever else, I'll work on trying to get our current apple cert renewed
 669 2017-11-09T19:24:41  <wumpus> makes sense
 670 2017-11-09T19:24:43  <morcos> cfields: i think it makes most sense to do that.
 671 2017-11-09T19:25:11  <wumpus> any name would give conspiracy theories anyway, I don't really think it's so bad to have TBF as signing organization
 672 2017-11-09T19:25:14  <Provoostenator> Or Gitan Code Signing LLC, if other projects want their stuff signed too?
 673 2017-11-09T19:25:19  <gmaxwell> If someone wants to work on stuffing rsa numbers into CSRs, I can show them out to use the RSA MPC code (have to remember it myself first, but it's not hard)
 674 2017-11-09T19:25:22  <cfields> but i think we need a plan b. no clue if the resources/accounts/etc. are still live and available
 675 2017-11-09T19:25:25  <luke-jr> Provoostenator: good idea
 676 2017-11-09T19:25:33  <jonasschnelli> I kinda like the idea of a "Bitcoin Core Code Signing Assoc."
 677 2017-11-09T19:25:37  <cfields> gmaxwell: yes, i'd very very much like to do that
 678 2017-11-09T19:25:42  <cfields> so i'll volunteer for that
 679 2017-11-09T19:25:49  <achow101> do we really need code signed binaries though?
 680 2017-11-09T19:25:55  <cfields> tired of 10hr builds and signing on my damn laptop
 681 2017-11-09T19:26:11  <gmaxwell> wumpus: well at least TBF isn't any _new_ conspiracy theories... though it does kinda suck. :)
 682 2017-11-09T19:26:19  <cfields> achow101: yea. necessary evil, im afraid
 683 2017-11-09T19:26:29  <luke-jr> achow101: some variants of Mac and Windows won't let users run unsigned stuff or something like that
 684 2017-11-09T19:26:33  <wumpus> yes, otherwise all virus scanners will trigger on it and such
 685 2017-11-09T19:26:37  <achow101> luke-jr: well that's annoying
 686 2017-11-09T19:26:49  <Provoostenator> As an aside: has any one ever tried submitting to the Mac App Store?
 687 2017-11-09T19:27:03  *** chjj has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
 688 2017-11-09T19:27:08  <jonasschnelli> Provoostenator: no.. we won't
 689 2017-11-09T19:27:35  <jonasschnelli> This means the binaries are under APPLs control
 690 2017-11-09T19:27:35  <jonasschnelli> Would someone disagree on founding a "Bitcoin Core Code Signing Association" based in Switzerland?...
 691 2017-11-09T19:27:44  <jonasschnelli> (we could just try and also follow the path of renewing the current cert)
 692 2017-11-09T19:27:49  <wumpus> jonasschnelli: no, would be great
 693 2017-11-09T19:27:58  <luke-jr> jonasschnelli: "Gitian Code Signing" would be better as Provoostenator suggested
 694 2017-11-09T19:28:05  <gmaxwell> jonasschnelli: sounds fine to me, whatever is the path of least resistance.
 695 2017-11-09T19:28:08  <wumpus> luke-jr: I think that makes the scope too wide
 696 2017-11-09T19:28:13  <gmaxwell> I'd rather not introduce a new word 'gitian' to users.
 697 2017-11-09T19:28:15  <morcos> Let's please leave whatever we do focused on Bitcoin Core
 698 2017-11-09T19:28:17  <BlueMatt> it should probably have "Bitcoin Core" in the name
 699 2017-11-09T19:28:25  <BlueMatt> jonasschnelli: yes, please register, thanks!
 700 2017-11-09T19:28:41  <MarcoFalke> #action Register "Bitcoin Core Code Signing Association"
 701 2017-11-09T19:28:44  <luke-jr> BlueMatt: then you'll whine that it can't be shared
 702 2017-11-09T19:28:51  <wumpus> luke-jr: I don't personally have a problem with signing knots executables, but making it soo general means we'll have a bureaucracy about what to sign blabla, and btw devrandom owns the name gitian :)
 703 2017-11-09T19:28:52  <sipa> and then we'd apply for code signing keys under that association's name, using the MPC RSA scheme?
 704 2017-11-09T19:28:53  <meshcollider> jonasschnelli: sounds good to me
 705 2017-11-09T19:29:05  <jonasschnelli> Okay... I'll let that happen and register with apple
 706 2017-11-09T19:29:05  <sipa> (or at least eventually)
 707 2017-11-09T19:29:13  <Provoostenator> Decentralized Code Signers LLC?
 708 2017-11-09T19:29:16  <wumpus> sipa: yes, at least eventually
 709 2017-11-09T19:29:17  <BlueMatt> luke-jr: I object to it being shared, it is not *that* hard for you to get your own cert for your own project.....
 710 2017-11-09T19:29:17  <gmaxwell> sipa: yes, thats the idea.
 711 2017-11-09T19:29:20  <jonasschnelli> sipa: not sure it that is possible with apples key enrolling process
 712 2017-11-09T19:29:27  <sipa> jonasschnelli: i don't see why not
 713 2017-11-09T19:29:27  <BlueMatt> sipa: yes
 714 2017-11-09T19:29:30  <cfields> wumpus: exactly. The question to ask is: would we want btc1 signed with the same key?
 715 2017-11-09T19:29:45  <jonasschnelli> I'll focus on the legal association stuff maybe someone can try to look into the MPC RSA sheme with apple OSX signing keys
 716 2017-11-09T19:29:45  <sipa> jonasschnelli: assuming all the plumbing work is done
 717 2017-11-09T19:29:46  <wumpus> cfields: right, no we don't :)
 718 2017-11-09T19:29:52  <luke-jr> BlueMatt: it's a waste of money to a bad corp and a waste of time, at the very least
 719 2017-11-09T19:29:52  <achow101> does anyone have a link to the rsa mpc thing?
 720 2017-11-09T19:29:54  <gmaxwell> I wouldn't want any of us us wasting time helping with an adversarial project.
 721 2017-11-09T19:29:57  <morcos> Guys, if you are signing code, you are responsible for that code.  If we are signing it in the name of Bitcoin Core we are all taking responsibility.  Please let's limit this discussion to the code we all work on together
 722 2017-11-09T19:30:09  <Provoostenator> Makes sense
 723 2017-11-09T19:30:13  <sipa> well, in the MPC setting, the group of signers would be fixed
 724 2017-11-09T19:30:17  <morcos> someone can always separately create a more general entity to sign other projects, but thats not related to Core
 725 2017-11-09T19:30:30  <sipa> the project should be signing the things that group of signers is jointly interested in signing
 726 2017-11-09T19:30:32  <wumpus> yeah it's typical scope creep
 727 2017-11-09T19:30:37  <gmaxwell> achow101: I'll give you the link after the meeting.
 728 2017-11-09T19:30:40  <kanzure> or bike shedding on name
 729 2017-11-09T19:30:42  <wumpus> let's sign the entire world :p
 730 2017-11-09T19:30:42  <cfields> gmaxwell: right. I was making the point that it would be impossible to draw the line unless core-specific.
 731 2017-11-09T19:30:45  <achow101> gmaxwell: k, thanks
 732 2017-11-09T19:31:14  <MarcoFalke> Any other topics?
 733 2017-11-09T19:31:21  <BlueMatt> promag: CValidationInterface is where you learn things from consensus code (ie from CChainState after 10279 or validation.cpp otherwise) - its also where you learn about mempool things but I have a branch which comes after 10286 that splits the interface up between the two to differentiate a little bit....wrt threading, CValidationInterface listeners all move into the scheduler, which means you dont have any deadlocking issues since
 734 2017-11-09T19:31:22  <BlueMatt> they're all just called async, this is mostly complete in 10286, but cleaning up the remaining few isnt too hard...thats pretty much it, there's not much to it...net/net_processing is a different issue, and is mostly around moving things from CNode to CNodeState and disconnecting those two things being so closely joined, but the threading issues there are less of the primary concern (except for cs_main being too heavily shared between
 735 2017-11-09T19:31:22  <BlueMatt> net_processing for mapNodeState and everything else)
 736 2017-11-09T19:31:28  <gmaxwell> it is unfortunate that e.g. knots has an uphill time there, it's a barrier to entry that shouldn't exist. But it's also not one we created.
 737 2017-11-09T19:31:37  <luke-jr> cfields: except Knots and Core have the same developers
 738 2017-11-09T19:31:38  <wumpus> gmaxwell: I agree
 739 2017-11-09T19:31:53  <cfields> luke-jr: as does btc1...
 740 2017-11-09T19:31:56  <sipa> luke-jr: they don't have the same maintainers
 741 2017-11-09T19:31:58  <luke-jr> cfields: hardly
 742 2017-11-09T19:32:35  <sipa> i don't think everyone who is interested in signing off on core releases is interested in doing the same work for knots - and perhaps the other way around
 743 2017-11-09T19:32:58  <cfields> luke-jr: i hope it's clear that I'm not trying to lump you in with an adversarial fork. Just making the point that the distinction in terms of signing is hard to draw.
 744 2017-11-09T19:32:59  <luke-jr> "We Just Codesign Stuff We Want, LLC" XD
 745 2017-11-09T19:33:15  <cfields> luke-jr: that's my end goal, actually
 746 2017-11-09T19:33:15  <jonasschnelli> Indeed
 747 2017-11-09T19:33:16  <jonasschnelli> It's one entity luke-jr
 748 2017-11-09T19:33:22  <wumpus> well adversarial versus consensus-compatible is easy to draw
 749 2017-11-09T19:33:24  <gmaxwell> there is another issue, I'm pretty sure that apple will not grant a key to "I sign random shit LLC"
 750 2017-11-09T19:33:35  <jonasschnelli> You can found a "Knots Code Signing Assoc"
 751 2017-11-09T19:33:36  <promag> thanks BlueMatt, I'll read that in a bit
 752 2017-11-09T19:33:38  <cfields> to create a body like Let's Encrypt, which attests to the fact that code -> binary.
 753 2017-11-09T19:34:04  <wumpus> cfields: that would be awesome
 754 2017-11-09T19:34:06  <luke-jr> cfields: well, how to stop malware from using it?
 755 2017-11-09T19:34:13  <achow101> cfields: well that's a whole separate thing which we can join once it exists :)
 756 2017-11-09T19:34:20  <wumpus> but it's outside the scope of the bitcoin core project
 757 2017-11-09T19:34:23  <wumpus> any other topics?
 758 2017-11-09T19:34:24  <cfields> luke-jr: deterministic malware would have to be welcome, unfortunately
 759 2017-11-09T19:34:51  <luke-jr> that'd just get the key revoked
 760 2017-11-09T19:34:55  <gmaxwell> not like this stuff actually stops malware, snake oil security. alas.
 761 2017-11-09T19:35:07  <gmaxwell> in any case, a discussion for another time.
 762 2017-11-09T19:36:11  <wumpus> ok, no other topics
 763 2017-11-09T19:36:19  <wumpus> #endmeeting
 764 2017-11-09T19:36:19  <lightningbot> Meeting ended Thu Nov  9 19:36:19 2017 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)
 765 2017-11-09T19:36:19  <lightningbot> Minutes:        http://www.erisian.com.au/meetbot/bitcoin-core-dev/2017/bitcoin-core-dev.2017-11-09-19.02.html
 766 2017-11-09T19:36:19  <lightningbot> Minutes (text): http://www.erisian.com.au/meetbot/bitcoin-core-dev/2017/bitcoin-core-dev.2017-11-09-19.02.txt
 767 2017-11-09T19:36:19  <lightningbot> Log:            http://www.erisian.com.au/meetbot/bitcoin-core-dev/2017/bitcoin-core-dev.2017-11-09-19.02.log.html
 768 2017-11-09T19:37:32  <achow101> well that was short
 769 2017-11-09T19:37:48  *** bule has quit IRC
 770 2017-11-09T19:38:06  <gmaxwell> achow101: the links are here https://github.com/kljensen/viff/blob/master/doc/applications.txt#L59
 771 2017-11-09T19:38:28  <wumpus> achow101: very efficient, can spent the rest of the time on reviewing high-priority PRs if you want :)
 772 2017-11-09T19:39:19  <promag> guys, what do you think about implicit sharing (or copy on write) for some structures, like cchain?
 773 2017-11-09T19:39:27  <meshcollider> jonasschnelli: Is it true that an LLC in Switzerland needs at least CHF 20,000 capital?
 774 2017-11-09T19:39:40  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke opened pull request #11647: 0.15: Backports (0.15...Mf1711-0152backports) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11647
 775 2017-11-09T19:39:48  <wumpus> meshcollider: that's the case here in the netherlands
 776 2017-11-09T19:40:01  <gmaxwell> achow101: the key gen is really slow, but who cares... signing is fast.
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 778 2017-11-09T19:40:12  <sipa> meshcollider: 3 BTC doesn't *sound* like much at all :p
 779 2017-11-09T19:40:25  <BlueMatt> if thats the case might as well just create a US LLC
 780 2017-11-09T19:40:29  <BlueMatt> cost is trivial
 781 2017-11-09T19:40:33  <gmaxwell> achow101: IIRC that implementation is setup for three parties, but it would be relatively straight forward to adjust it for more.
 782 2017-11-09T19:40:35  <jonasschnelli> meshcollider: 10k for a GmbH
 783 2017-11-09T19:40:51  <jonasschnelli> jonasschnelli: but we do an association.. which is almost free (maybe 1k)
 784 2017-11-09T19:40:57  <sipa> promag: cchain is pretty big
 785 2017-11-09T19:41:00  <meshcollider> Heh yeah sounds like quite a lot for a code signing only company
 786 2017-11-09T19:41:05  <BlueMatt> jonasschnelli: i believe us is like 50$
 787 2017-11-09T19:41:36  *** Deacydal has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
 788 2017-11-09T19:41:44  <promag> sipa: you don't have to copy everything
 789 2017-11-09T19:41:45  <BlueMatt> (but I think in most states yearly to file tax returns)
 790 2017-11-09T19:42:10  <achow101> gmaxwell: thanks. I'm going to try taking a look at it
 791 2017-11-09T19:42:10  <sipa> promag: not without introducing massive granularity
 792 2017-11-09T19:42:23  <jonasschnelli> BlueMatt: that's why people trust swiss companies more then US. :)
 793 2017-11-09T19:42:45  <BlueMatt> jonasschnelli: would you prefer I do something in .us?
 794 2017-11-09T19:42:53  <sipa> promag: if there is ever a point where concurrency is hurt by needing a consistent CChain, i think the solution is to stop using CChain for that purpose (CChain is just an optimized-for-seeking copy of CBlockIndex)
 795 2017-11-09T19:43:04  <jonasschnelli> For the simplest form of a registered non-single-person company, the GmbH, you need to deposit 10k and have liability (personal) for 20k
 796 2017-11-09T19:43:10  <jonasschnelli> BlueMatt: no.. please not US
 797 2017-11-09T19:43:29  <BlueMatt> I mean its not like the company will even hold the cert
 798 2017-11-09T19:43:29  <meshcollider> jonasschnelli is there any difference between an association and an LLC in terms of getting the certs
 799 2017-11-09T19:43:36  <BlueMatt> only exist as a legal entity to exist
 800 2017-11-09T19:43:42  <jonasschnelli> Or the association member may have troubles getting a US visa. :()
 801 2017-11-09T19:43:57  <BlueMatt> jonasschnelli: I presume there will be no "members"
 802 2017-11-09T19:44:14  <meshcollider> Or wumpus will be so he gets the cert?
 803 2017-11-09T19:44:33  <gmaxwell> the only concern about the entity is that it could get more certs but I don't think we care, since the fact that apple et. al. can issue as many as they want regardless.
 804 2017-11-09T19:44:53  <gmaxwell> meshcollider: we're hopefully going to use multiparty computation so no one person has the cert.'
 805 2017-11-09T19:44:55  <morcos> i think it makes sense for it to be jonas or someone not related to the Blockstream/Chaincode conspiracy who does this
 806 2017-11-09T19:44:58  <BlueMatt> gmaxwell: I'm gonna go out on a limb and bet that almost anyone would claim to be a representative of the company and apple would buy it
 807 2017-11-09T19:45:03  *** chjj has quit IRC
 808 2017-11-09T19:45:17  <jonasschnelli> BlueMatt: an official assiciation needs to have member
 809 2017-11-09T19:45:19  <jonasschnelli> (but only in the background)
 810 2017-11-09T19:45:23  <jonasschnelli> LLC is US imo
 811 2017-11-09T19:45:33  * luke-jr wonders if a non-developer should do this
 812 2017-11-09T19:45:48  <cfields> my original suggestion was the DCI, but that got drowned out in the discussion
 813 2017-11-09T19:45:50  <gmaxwell> lol please, no more non-developers.
 814 2017-11-09T19:45:55  <BlueMatt> jonasschnelli: I mean ok, if you hate the idea of a us LLC, fine, I just figure its not worth wasting 1k on it, but....ok
 815 2017-11-09T19:45:58  <cfields> (also, i realize that everyone is just suggesting their own org :p )
 816 2017-11-09T19:46:00  <BlueMatt> gmaxwell: yea...that
 817 2017-11-09T19:46:10  <wumpus> cfields: DCI would be fine with me too
 818 2017-11-09T19:46:14  <sdaftuar> cfields: i am not suggesting my own org! :)
 819 2017-11-09T19:46:18  <luke-jr> cfields: everyone else is suggesting not-our-org it sounds like
 820 2017-11-09T19:46:20  <wumpus> cfields: this is just to have alternatives
 821 2017-11-09T19:46:35  * BlueMatt doesnt care, I was trying to save jonasschnelli 1000$, but the purpose is to exist, not do *do* anything
 822 2017-11-09T19:46:36  <jonasschnelli> I'm not really familiar with US legal company/association constructs....
 823 2017-11-09T19:47:01  <BlueMatt> jonasschnelli: all that matters is its cheaper :p
 824 2017-11-09T19:47:11  <gmaxwell> I would rather not use DCI simply because we really have suffered from people using that stupid message as proof BCF controls bitcoin. I'd rather the name be more benign. (the "foo code signing" sort).
 825 2017-11-09T19:47:19  <promag> sipa: consider a long rpc call, it locks cs_main and replies a big json - how can it avoid the cs_main lock?
 826 2017-11-09T19:47:20  <jonasschnelli> DCI would be fine for me as well, though I prefer "Bitcoin Core Code Signing Assocation" over "DCI" (which is a private owned company) in the signing details
 827 2017-11-09T19:47:47  <wumpus> yes on the longer term having our own signing org would certainly be preferable, I agree
 828 2017-11-09T19:47:51  <gmaxwell> "Orginization which does not control Bitcoin. LLC"
 829 2017-11-09T19:48:16  <gmaxwell> yea, for a stopgap, whatever works. hopefully we can just.
 830 2017-11-09T19:48:18  <jonasschnelli> BlueMatt: I guess the 1000$ is for the lawyers setup,... I guess I would need the same for the LLC process (or someone needs to fill out the application form which then leads to lost 1000$ in development ressources)
 831 2017-11-09T19:48:19  <cfields> well, this may shortcut the discussion a bit...
 832 2017-11-09T19:48:28  <BlueMatt> ok, are there any remaining questions aside from "does jonasschnelli want to register it as a swiss org, or do we want someone in .us to spend the 35$ to make it happen here"
 833 2017-11-09T19:48:28  <wumpus> DCI sounds sufficiently neutral to me though
 834 2017-11-09T19:48:54  <cfields> from a quick glance, looks pretty possible that I can renew with the current cert
 835 2017-11-09T19:49:02  <gmaxwell> lol
 836 2017-11-09T19:49:03  <achow101> who would be the named members/officers/whatever of said organization/association/llc
 837 2017-11-09T19:49:05  <wumpus> cfields: nice!
 838 2017-11-09T19:49:06  <sipa> promag: accessing CBlockIndex entries does not require a lock to access most fields (as they are immutable)
 839 2017-11-09T19:49:07  <BlueMatt> jonasschnelli: the registration process for an org in the us can be pretty easily diy-d, especially if you're never going to *use* the org
 840 2017-11-09T19:49:07  <luke-jr> why does it need to be Core-specific? just a redundant waste of money and time to then get another one for Knots, when it could just as easily be a shared effort. sigh.
 841 2017-11-09T19:49:18  <BlueMatt> achow101: who cares?
 842 2017-11-09T19:49:18  <gmaxwell> achow101: we should create a UK org, you can name anyone you want as the officers.
 843 2017-11-09T19:49:22  <jonasschnelli> BlueMatt: let me first check the real costs here in CH
 844 2017-11-09T19:49:22  <jonasschnelli> I know it's basically free... but someone needs to do the paperwork...
 845 2017-11-09T19:49:29  <jonasschnelli> Which is the significant costs IMO
 846 2017-11-09T19:49:33  <luke-jr> gmaxwell: even without their consent? XD
 847 2017-11-09T19:49:33  <gmaxwell> achow101: and the registrations are visible online. :P
 848 2017-11-09T19:49:34  <jonasschnelli> Which *are
 849 2017-11-09T19:49:36  <meshcollider> BlueMatt does a US LLC need a bank account and everything?
 850 2017-11-09T19:49:36  <gmaxwell> luke-jr: yes.
 851 2017-11-09T19:49:40  <BlueMatt> meshcollider: no
 852 2017-11-09T19:49:41  <gmaxwell> meshcollider: no.
 853 2017-11-09T19:49:42  <BlueMatt> why would it?
 854 2017-11-09T19:49:46  <achow101> BlueMatt: people who want to look at the paperwork and then go "X controls bitcoin blarg" conspiracy
 855 2017-11-09T19:49:58  <meshcollider> Idk, some countries do dont they
 856 2017-11-09T19:50:04  <BlueMatt> all you have to do is file paperwork to create it, then file a tax return every year....some nominal cost to doing so, but IIRC 35$ for delaware
 857 2017-11-09T19:50:05  <luke-jr> gmaxwell: Satoshi Nakamoto, John Doe, Jane Doe, …
 858 2017-11-09T19:50:09  <gmaxwell> achow101: so e.g. we can list satoshi nakamoto, bill gates, donald trump...
 859 2017-11-09T19:50:17  <achow101> gmaxwell: lol
 860 2017-11-09T19:50:18  <BlueMatt> achow101: hence why its called "Code Signing, LLC" :p
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 862 2017-11-09T19:50:50  <achow101> meshcollider: it varies in the us by state. IIRC it costs almost nothing to register an LLC. pay the fee and submit paperwork and thats just about it
 863 2017-11-09T19:51:05  <BlueMatt> yea, that ^
 864 2017-11-09T19:51:24  <meshcollider> Ok sweet as
 865 2017-11-09T19:51:26  <gmaxwell> it does take a bit of time.
 866 2017-11-09T19:51:37  <jonasschnelli> I guess an US LLC is always tied to an individual, a person who found/owns the LLC?
 867 2017-11-09T19:51:48  <achow101> jonasschnelli: yes
 868 2017-11-09T19:51:58  <meshcollider> According to cagi.ch, "The creation of an association does not entail any administrative cost."
 869 2017-11-09T19:52:11  <achow101> that person also has to file taxes for the llc every year. but for something that does nothing and makes no money, that shouldn't be a problem
 870 2017-11-09T19:52:16  <sipa> promag: so if you want consistent but just read-only access to CChain, you could ibstead just briefly lock main, get a copy of chainActive.Tip() pointer, unlock, and then use the resulting CBlockIndex without any locks
 871 2017-11-09T19:52:16  <jonasschnelli> Where an association (in Switzerland at least) has no owner,... it just has members (which have different / exchangable roles)
 872 2017-11-09T19:52:41  <luke-jr> jonasschnelli: does Apple definitely recognise it?
 873 2017-11-09T19:52:45  <meshcollider> Association in Switzerland sounds cleaner than LLC in us imo
 874 2017-11-09T19:53:04  <jonasschnelli> meshcollider: "costs" are a wide term... fill out paperwork/forms for 2-3 can have costs...
 875 2017-11-09T19:53:14  <sipa> promag: CBlockIndex has efficient Ancestor function yo query at any height... not quite as efficient as looking up in CChain, but probably sufficient for almost anything
 876 2017-11-09T19:53:35  <jonasschnelli> luke-jr: just checking... but I know other swiss Assocaitions having an App in the App store... so it should work
 877 2017-11-09T19:53:49  <promag> right, only lacks Next
 878 2017-11-09T19:53:54  <BlueMatt> jonasschnelli: I dont think we care about ownership here - it literally will not even hold the keys
 879 2017-11-09T19:54:03  *** Deacyde has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
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 881 2017-11-09T19:54:36  <meshcollider> Jonasschnelli it also says "A Committee (comprising at least a president, a secretary, and a treasurer)." Not just members, irrelevant point though
 882 2017-11-09T19:54:46  <achow101> I guess the cost here is "how much money does someone need to pay for this thing to exist"
 883 2017-11-09T19:55:04  <jonasschnelli> A committee is required,.. yes. But it's flexible...
 884 2017-11-09T19:55:18  <jonasschnelli> achow101: + how much work does he need to spend
 885 2017-11-09T19:55:19  <meshcollider> Yep
 886 2017-11-09T19:56:15  <jonasschnelli> BlueMatt: The ownership can have some sideeffects... I personally don't want to be in a register with my Name tied to a company that have "Bitcoin" in it's name. For travel purposes...
 887 2017-11-09T19:56:18  <wumpus> wasn't it that you can put other companies as officers? :)
 888 2017-11-09T19:56:24  *** Murch has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
 889 2017-11-09T19:56:31  <wumpus> and create a recursive organization
 890 2017-11-09T19:56:44  <jonasschnelli> wumpus: I guess not for an association
 891 2017-11-09T19:56:51  <jonasschnelli> (for other companies that would work)
 892 2017-11-09T19:57:05  <jonasschnelli> although I may be wrong
 893 2017-11-09T19:57:41  <BlueMatt> jonasschnelli: heh, I'm not too worried, if they google any of us they'll find bitcoin faster than if they look at what companies we are connected to :p
 894 2017-11-09T19:57:48  <achow101> jonasschnelli: in the US, you could register in like Delaware where the business registrations are not public and can only be revealed by subpoena (or the like)
 895 2017-11-09T19:58:15  <wumpus> jonasschnelli: yes maybe that's only true in Panama :p
 896 2017-11-09T19:58:39  <wumpus> BlueMatt: I'm not really worried either, they know we're connected to the software project anyhow
 897 2017-11-09T19:59:34  <jonasschnelli> Yes... probably... though I'm always suprised how entering the country depends on the officers (and the little surface info he has) you have in front of you
 898 2017-11-09T20:00:02  <meshcollider> "LLCs in Delaware don’t file annual reports"
 899 2017-11-09T20:00:45  <wumpus> meshcollider: that's another popular location for shell companies right?
 900 2017-11-09T20:01:09  <jonasschnelli> However, next week i should have more bandwidth then 14.4kbds so I'll can check the details... and report in next weeks meeting
 901 2017-11-09T20:01:18  <meshcollider> I'd expect so, achow101 suggested it
 902 2017-11-09T20:01:38  <sipa> promag: but next is easy to implement as tip->Ancestor(prev->nHeight + 1) :)
 903 2017-11-09T20:01:41  <achow101> wumpus: a lot of big US companies are registered in delaware, e.g. Google
 904 2017-11-09T20:01:44  <luke-jr> TIL achow101 is well-known for suggesting shell company locations
 905 2017-11-09T20:02:34  <wumpus> luke-jr: hah
 906 2017-11-09T20:02:46  <achow101> there's also a few other states too
 907 2017-11-09T20:02:55  <sipa> unfortunately, someone would just need to know the information was suggested by achow101, to guess
 908 2017-11-09T20:03:17  <meshcollider> Sounds like delaware is good for avoiding lots of tax too, not that that matters here ;)
 909 2017-11-09T20:03:22  <achow101> luke-jr: well right now I'm taking a course about fraud and scams, and we came to the topic of shell companies and the panama papers recently :p
 910 2017-11-09T20:03:58  <luke-jr> i c
 911 2017-11-09T20:04:33  <meshcollider> Oh, "Delaware LLCs do not file annual reports; instead, LLCs in Delaware file annual taxes. The annual tax is a flat $300."
 912 2017-11-09T20:04:37  *** deadlysin has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
 913 2017-11-09T20:06:26  <promag> cya later
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 921 2017-11-09T20:12:31  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 4 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/1f4375f8e75f...e6e3fc39518b
 922 2017-11-09T20:12:32  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 3155fd2 Jonas Schnelli: CKeystore: move relevant implementation out of the header
 923 2017-11-09T20:12:33  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 208fda6 Jonas Schnelli: CCrypter: move relevant implementation out of the header
 924 2017-11-09T20:12:33  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master dd9bb25 Jonas Schnelli: Fix code style in keystore.cpp/crypter.cpp
 925 2017-11-09T20:12:58  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj closed pull request #11272: CKeystore/CCrypter: move relevant implementation out of the header (master...2017/09/wallet_refact) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11272
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 927 2017-11-09T20:19:34  *** deadlysin is now known as deadlysin_
 928 2017-11-09T20:20:52  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 2 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/e6e3fc39518b...23e9074e0a36
 929 2017-11-09T20:20:52  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master ab8e8b9 practicalswift: Remove unused variables in shell scripts.
 930 2017-11-09T20:20:53  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 23e9074 Wladimir J. van der Laan: Merge #10771: Remove unused variables in shell scripts...
 931 2017-11-09T20:21:12  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj closed pull request #10771: Remove unused variables in shell scripts (master...unused-shell-variables) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/10771
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 935 2017-11-09T20:25:56  <wumpus>  * [new tag]         v0.15.1 -> v0.15.1
 936 2017-11-09T20:26:38  <BlueMatt> !
 937 2017-11-09T20:27:49  <wumpus> congrats everyone on the 0.15.1 release :)
 938 2017-11-09T20:34:26  <achow101> yay!
 939 2017-11-09T20:34:51  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 14 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/23e9074e0a36...5e9be169e430
 940 2017-11-09T20:34:53  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 860e912 practicalswift: Use unique_ptr for pwalletMain (CWallet)
 941 2017-11-09T20:34:53  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 5a6f768 practicalswift: Use unique_ptr for httpRPCTimerInterface (HTTPRPCTimerInterface)
 942 2017-11-09T20:34:53  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master fa6d122 practicalswift: Use unique_ptr:s for {fee,short,long}Stats (TxConfirmStats)
 943 2017-11-09T20:35:11  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj closed pull request #11043: Use std::unique_ptr (C++11) where possible (master...unique-pointers) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11043
 944 2017-11-09T20:38:30  *** cl0uding has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
 945 2017-11-09T20:40:15  *** aj_ is now known as aj
 946 2017-11-09T20:45:50  <meshcollider> I'll write a release page for bitcoincore.org later if no one else does
 947 2017-11-09T20:52:48  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] jnewbery opened pull request #11648: [tests] Add primitives.py (master...add_primitives_py) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11648
 948 2017-11-09T20:53:05  *** RealM9 has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
 949 2017-11-09T20:53:43  <RealM9> Hello, which paper wallet generator can be trusted?
 950 2017-11-09T20:53:58  <RealM9> (Asking it here, because i trust core devs)
 951 2017-11-09T20:54:21  <RealM9> Is bit address safe?
 952 2017-11-09T20:56:26  *** RealM9 has quit IRC
 953 2017-11-09T20:57:52  <aj> jonasschnelli: is there really a question about #8550 being qt only or having a non-qt stats collector? having non-qt access to info always seems better, at a minimum for tests and the like...
 954 2017-11-09T20:57:55  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/8550 | [Qt] Add interactive mempool graph by jonasschnelli · Pull Request #8550 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
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 959 2017-11-09T21:05:17  <wumpus> aj jonasschnelli I tend to agree, though getting things merged w/ the GUI tends to be easier than JSON API changes
 960 2017-11-09T21:05:32  <wumpus> in any case the end goal is to have both
 961 2017-11-09T21:05:47  <aj> wumpus: (loving watching all the commits going through today)
 962 2017-11-09T21:06:22  <wumpus> I really want the GUI interactive mempool graph in, because it is appealing to people
 963 2017-11-09T21:07:01  <wumpus> aj: yes, much progress today
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 965 2017-11-09T21:09:56  <cfields> meshcollider: that reminds me, anyone else getting a cert issue for bitcoincore.org ?
 966 2017-11-09T21:12:03  <cfields> wumpus: and, looks like i was wrong about an easy cert renewal. going deeper now.
 967 2017-11-09T21:13:44  <aj> cfields: bitcoincore.org seems fine here (firefox sees a let's encrypt cert)
 968 2017-11-09T21:14:24  <wumpus> cfields: uh oh
 969 2017-11-09T21:14:43  <wumpus> aj: he means the code signing cert, web certs are much easier luckily
 970 2017-11-09T21:14:50  <cfields> aj: ah right, thanks for confirming
 971 2017-11-09T21:15:09  <cfields> wumpus: nah, i meant the site. forgot i had a dns hack in place
 972 2017-11-09T21:15:11  <cfields> damn you BlueMatt!
 973 2017-11-09T21:15:15  <wumpus> oh
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 978 2017-11-09T21:25:09  <BlueMatt> cfields: lol, uhhhh, I have no idea what server you were accessing that had an old cert
 979 2017-11-09T21:25:11  <BlueMatt> thats...strange
 980 2017-11-09T21:25:42  <cfields> BlueMatt: it was pointed at bitcoin.org for some experiment
 981 2017-11-09T21:25:48  <BlueMatt> lolk
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 984 2017-11-09T21:26:30  <cfields> no worries, all good now
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 990 2017-11-09T21:41:28  <luke-jr> ‎[21:06:22] ‎<‎wumpus‎>‎ I really want the GUI interactive mempool graph in, because it is appealing to people <-- it conflicts with its dependency nowadays :x
 991 2017-11-09T21:41:40  <luke-jr> although I have it in Knots with an older version of the dep
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 993 2017-11-09T21:46:41  <gmaxwell> luke-jr: what dependency
 994 2017-11-09T21:46:54  <luke-jr> gmaxwell: the stats collection stuff
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 996 2017-11-09T21:49:57  <aj> luke-jr: i did a rebase of the qt bit in a PR against jonas's repo fwiw, https://github.com/btc1/bitcoin/issues/140
 997 2017-11-09T21:50:32  <aj> luke-jr: (rebased on top of jonas's repo for the json bit)
 998 2017-11-09T21:51:32  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke opened pull request #11649: Revert "Remove unused variable in shell script" (master...Mf1711-revertRemove) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11649
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1001 2017-11-09T22:03:51  <luke-jr> aj: did you link the wrong thing?
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1003 2017-11-09T22:05:41  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke pushed 2 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/5e9be169e430...c838283ecdfb
1004 2017-11-09T22:05:42  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master fa0025d MarcoFalke: Revert "Remove unused variable in shell script"...
1005 2017-11-09T22:05:42  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master c838283 MarcoFalke: Merge #11649: Revert "Remove unused variable in shell script"...
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1007 2017-11-09T22:06:12  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke closed pull request #11649: Revert "Remove unused variable in shell script" (master...Mf1711-revertRemove) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11649
1008 2017-11-09T22:09:56  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke pushed 3 new commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/c838283ecdfb...6e4e98ee8ce2
1009 2017-11-09T22:09:57  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master e1d0cc2 Pieter Wuille: Improve git-subtree-check.sh...
1010 2017-11-09T22:09:58  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 487aff4 Pieter Wuille: Check subtree consistency in Travis
1011 2017-11-09T22:09:58  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 6e4e98e MarcoFalke: Merge #11394: Perform a weaker subtree check in Travis...
1012 2017-11-09T22:09:59  <wumpus> MarcoFalke: huh, I'm 100% sure I checked all the variables
1013 2017-11-09T22:10:15  <wumpus> no match for $old in that script
1014 2017-11-09T22:10:21  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke closed pull request #11394: Perform a weaker subtree check in Travis (master...201709_travis_subtree) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11394
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1016 2017-11-09T22:10:28  <MarcoFalke> wumpus: Not your fault :)
1017 2017-11-09T22:10:54  <MarcoFalke> It was only used in one of the sipa/bitcoin.git branches
1018 2017-11-09T22:11:05  <MarcoFalke> I guess you didn't check them
1019 2017-11-09T22:11:19  <sipa> hmm, did i miss something?
1020 2017-11-09T22:11:19  <wumpus> no, I checked our own repository only
1021 2017-11-09T22:11:44  <MarcoFalke> sipa: no
1022 2017-11-09T22:11:53  <MarcoFalke> all should be fine now
1023 2017-11-09T22:13:30  <wumpus> ok
1024 2017-11-09T22:16:22  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke closed pull request #11582: wallet: Restore -usehd=0 option (master...usehd) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11582
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1026 2017-11-09T22:22:05  <aj> luke-jr: yes, yes i did. https://github.com/jonasschnelli/bitcoin/pull/9
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