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 76 2019-03-01T08:35:35  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] gwillen opened pull request #15508: Refactor analyzepsbt for use outside RPC code (master...feature-separate-analyzepsbt) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/15508
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 87 2019-03-01T09:41:41  <meshcollider> remember the wallet meeting is tomorrow/today
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100 2019-03-01T10:28:43  <hyperwang> f
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108 2019-03-01T10:58:13  <provoostenator> meshcollider: awesome
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111 2019-03-01T11:01:21  <fanquake> meshcollider how long until that?
112 2019-03-01T11:17:55  <provoostenator> fanquake: 19:00 GMT / Iceland time
113 2019-03-01T11:18:38  <provoostenator> I like how this is almost an ad for GMT: https://time.is/nl/GMT
114 2019-03-01T11:18:54  <provoostenator> "No daylight saving time, same UTC offset all year"
115 2019-03-01T11:23:09  <tryphe> provoostenator, Iceland has darkness saving time =p
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117 2019-03-01T11:25:35  <fanquake> provoostenator right, so same as usual meeting time? 3am
118 2019-03-01T11:26:16  <fanquake> I played around with the deterministic builds for HWI today, got stuck with wine and page faults.
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121 2019-03-01T11:55:45  <jonasschnelli> hmm... "bitcoin-addcon invoked oom-killer"
122 2019-03-01T11:56:01  <jonasschnelli> Ran current master on a 4GB ARM with -dbache=2000
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130 2019-03-01T12:49:20  <fanquake> promag is 15478 part of, or the fix for 15453 ?
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137 2019-03-01T13:44:05  <jonasschnelli> What could be the reason why bitcoind uses 3GB of ram (RES) when running with -dbcache=2000?
138 2019-03-01T13:44:08  <instagibbs> gwillen, TIL we wrapped boost optional in core :)
139 2019-03-01T13:44:22  <jonasschnelli> I'm aware that the maxmempool gets added to the cache during IBD
140 2019-03-01T13:45:46  <jonasschnelli> 3GB - 300MB mempool - 2GB dbcache makes still 700MB for core without the mempool...
141 2019-03-01T13:47:46  <jonasschnelli> OMG... ignore me. I should sleep more, I set the dbcache to 20GB
142 2019-03-01T13:48:16  * jonasschnelli blames the stupid and broken MacBookPro keyboard
143 2019-03-01T13:56:10  <provoostenator> Why buy a reliable keyboard if you can buy more RAM?
144 2019-03-01T14:01:11  <jonasschnelli> heh
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148 2019-03-01T14:06:00  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke pushed 2 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/29c24b05fb71...e8612adc5d07
149 2019-03-01T14:06:01  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master fa852f0 MarcoFalke: test: Bump timeout on tests that timeout on windows
150 2019-03-01T14:06:01  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master e8612ad MarcoFalke: Merge #15507: test: Bump timeout on tests that timeout on windows
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153 2019-03-01T14:06:54  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke merged pull request #15507: test: Bump timeout on tests that timeout on windows (master...1903-testTimeoutWindows) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/15507
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158 2019-03-01T14:14:44  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke pushed 6 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/e8612adc5d07...a6d7026a45c9
159 2019-03-01T14:14:51  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 7aa6a8a Pieter Wuille: Add ParseRange function to parse args of the form int/[int,int]
160 2019-03-01T14:14:51  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 6b9f45e Pieter Wuille: Support ranges arguments in RPC help
161 2019-03-01T14:14:51  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 4566011 Pieter Wuille: Add support for stop/[start,stop] ranges to scantxoutset
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164 2019-03-01T14:15:30  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke merged pull request #15497: rpc: Consistent range arguments in scantxoutset/importmulti/deriveaddresses (master...201902_rpcconsistentrange) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/15497
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171 2019-03-01T14:24:29  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke opened pull request #15509: [rpc] deriveaddresses: add range to CRPCConvertParam (master...1903-rpcDeriveAddress) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/15509
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174 2019-03-01T14:25:00  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] Sjors opened pull request #15510: [rpc] deriveaddresses: add range to CRPCConvertParam (master...2019/02/rpcconsistentrange) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/15510
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176 2019-03-01T14:25:08  <MarcoFalke> lol
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178 2019-03-01T14:25:24  <provoostenator> Oops
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180 2019-03-01T14:25:35  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke closed pull request #15509: [rpc] deriveaddresses: add range to CRPCConvertParam (master...1903-rpcDeriveAddress) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/15509
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182 2019-03-01T14:26:15  <promag> wat!
183 2019-03-01T14:27:45  <instagibbs> awkward
184 2019-03-01T14:27:59  <promag> provoostenator: MarcoFalke: well played, you don't fool us X)
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186 2019-03-01T14:29:57  <MarcoFalke> eh? My pull was opened earlier! xD
187 2019-03-01T14:30:24  <fanquake> race
188 2019-03-01T14:30:52  * MarcoFalke fixes race in deriveaddress
189 2019-03-01T14:31:26  <promag> MarcoFalke: true! then provoostenator commits fast
190 2019-03-01T14:31:34  <MarcoFalke> promag: ERROR: deriveaddresses argument 1 is named range in vRPCConvertParams but ['begin'] in dispatch table
191 2019-03-01T14:32:03  <MarcoFalke> I guess named args don't work then
192 2019-03-01T14:32:42  <promag> where do you get that?
193 2019-03-01T14:33:18  <fanquake> promag https://travis-ci.org/bitcoin/bitcoin/jobs/500366793
194 2019-03-01T14:33:44  <promag> fanquake: thanks, just saw it too
195 2019-03-01T14:34:30  <fanquake> promag you might have missed my question above^. Is 15478 part of, or the fix for 15453 ?
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197 2019-03-01T14:36:38  <promag> yes the goal of that should fix 15453
198 2019-03-01T14:39:57  <fanquake> ok
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206 2019-03-01T14:49:15  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke pushed 2 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/a6d7026a45c9...dc251de6a5c4
207 2019-03-01T14:49:15  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master aeb7fbf Chun Kuan Lee: appveyor: Don't build debug libraries instead of "build and delete"
208 2019-03-01T14:49:15  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master dc251de MarcoFalke: Merge #15506: appveyor: fix cache issue and reduce dependencies build time...
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211 2019-03-01T14:49:57  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke merged pull request #15506: appveyor: fix cache issue and reduce dependencies build time (master...appveyor-release-only) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/15506
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216 2019-03-01T15:03:25  <darosior> Hi, I saw that in init.cpp the service NODE_NETWORK_LIMITED is set with NODE_NETWORK at the begining, but I wonder why it is not reset if we did not pruned the block chain ? (https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/b4fc5257b7dc106ff210d170397d4ce0e024f2c0/src/init.cpp#L1652)
217 2019-03-01T15:04:14  <provoostenator> Surprising how many testnet peers are still stuck at the CVE-2018-17144 exploit block. https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/79662/solving-bitcoin-cores-activatebestchain-failed
218 2019-03-01T15:04:38  <gmaxwell> darosior: limited means the node can ALSO serve recent blocks, services are additive.
219 2019-03-01T15:05:00  <provoostenator> My node shows lots of "Disconnecting outbound peer 5 for old chain, best known block = 00000000210004840364b52bc5e455d888f164e4264a4fec06a514b67e9d5722"
220 2019-03-01T15:05:11  <darosior> gmaxwell : Thank you.
221 2019-03-01T15:05:48  <gmaxwell> provoostenator: most testnet nodes are just forgotten old software, this has more or less always been true. :)
222 2019-03-01T15:06:17  <darosior> gmaxwell : It is indicated "only" instead of "also" in the comment https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/a6d7026a45c915794338c178b7f95d5c1f8e977f/src/protocol.h#L267
223 2019-03-01T15:07:28  <gmaxwell> darosior: you're misunderstanding the comment.
224 2019-03-01T15:07:28  <provoostenator> getchaintips shows this particular block as  "headers-only", which I guess is why it doesn't immediately disconnect from nodes with this block?
225 2019-03-01T15:07:56  <gmaxwell> darosior: limited = NETWORK-old_blocks    so NETWORK + LIMITED = NETWORK
226 2019-03-01T15:09:52  <darosior> gmaxwell : Ok, thank you.
227 2019-03-01T15:11:20  <provoostenator> (it took 22 minutes from connecting to disconnecting)
228 2019-03-01T15:12:16  <gmaxwell> provoostenator: it won't attempt to fetch it because its clearly a losing chaintip.
229 2019-03-01T15:12:53  <gmaxwell> provoostenator: it also wouldn't be good to disconnect immediately because that would prevent the peer getting blocks from you and reorging to your chain (if it could)
230 2019-03-01T15:13:43  <provoostenator> Ah ok, so it's altruistic intended behavior then. That also applies even if we did know it was invalid?
231 2019-03-01T15:15:40  <gmaxwell> provoostenator: it's incorrect to call that altruistic, as getting the rest of the network on to your chain is very much in your interest... but the getting other people part is mostly accomplished by not doing that kind of strict behavior on inbound.
232 2019-03-01T15:16:10  <gmaxwell> if they actually send something invalid, we'll punt right away.
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236 2019-03-01T15:25:12  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] darosior opened pull request #15511: RPC : More user-friendly services field in getnetworkinfo and getpeerinfo (master...services_for_humans) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/15511
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240 2019-03-01T15:53:06  <MarcoFalke> I got the "lists.linuxfoundation.org mailing list memberships reminder", so at least it is not all-down
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242 2019-03-01T15:57:39  <gmaxwell> lol
243 2019-03-01T15:57:55  <gmaxwell> I suspect the list itself works, but it's all moderated and the moderation interface is down...
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246 2019-03-01T16:13:14  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] jonasschnelli opened pull request #15512: Add ChaCha20 encryption option (XOR) (master...2019/03/chacha) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/15512
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261 2019-03-01T17:40:29  <gwillen> instagibbs: yeah, I assume we wrap boost::optional so we can replace it with the std one when the time comes
262 2019-03-01T17:40:50  <sipa> indeed
263 2019-03-01T17:40:57  <instagibbs> roger that
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265 2019-03-01T17:42:03  <sipa> the source code says "
266 2019-03-01T17:42:10  <sipa> //! Substitute for C++17 std::optional"
267 2019-03-01T17:49:02  <gwillen> although I noticed when I was messing around in psbt.h that PartiallySignedTransaction has a boost::optional in it
268 2019-03-01T17:49:07  <gwillen> I left it alone but I'll change it if someone complains
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276 2019-03-01T18:55:58  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke pushed 3 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/dc251de6a5c4...f9dbb319d26f
277 2019-03-01T18:55:58  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 2fa85eb Adam Jonas: add rpc_misc.py, mv test getmemoryinfo, add test mallocinfo
278 2019-03-01T18:55:59  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master f13ad1c Adam Jonas: modify test for memory locked in case locking pages failed at some point
279 2019-03-01T18:55:59  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master f9dbb31 MarcoFalke: Merge #15485: add rpc_misc.py, mv test getmemoryinfo, add test mallocinfo
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282 2019-03-01T18:56:43  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke merged pull request #15485: add rpc_misc.py, mv test getmemoryinfo, add test mallocinfo (master...test_rpc_misc) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/15485
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284 2019-03-01T19:00:39  <meshcollider> wallet meeting time :)
285 2019-03-01T19:00:45  <meshcollider> #startmeeting
286 2019-03-01T19:00:45  <lightningbot> Meeting started Fri Mar  1 19:00:45 2019 UTC.  The chair is meshcollider. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
287 2019-03-01T19:00:45  <lightningbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
288 2019-03-01T19:00:47  <provoostenator> hi
289 2019-03-01T19:00:48  <sipa> present
290 2019-03-01T19:00:51  <meshcollider> #bitcoin-core-dev Wallet Meeting: wumpus sipa gmaxwell jonasschnelli morcos luke-jr sdaftuar jtimon cfields petertodd kanzure bluematt instagibbs phantomcircuit codeshark michagogo marcofalke paveljanik NicolasDorier jl2012 achow101 meshcollider jnewbery maaku fanquake promag provoostenator aj Chris_Stewart_5 dongcarl gwillen jamesob ken281221 ryanofsky gleb
291 2019-03-01T19:00:58  <instagibbs> hi
292 2019-03-01T19:01:17  <meshcollider> Topics for this week?
293 2019-03-01T19:01:31  <achow101> Hi
294 2019-03-01T19:01:50  <sipa> i guess there isn't anything wallet-related for 0.18
295 2019-03-01T19:02:27  <provoostenator> #15453
296 2019-03-01T19:02:29  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/15453 | Starting bitcoin-qt with -nowallet and then opening a wallet does not show the wallet · Issue #15453 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
297 2019-03-01T19:02:36  <provoostenator> Is tagged with 0.18 anyway
298 2019-03-01T19:03:02  <provoostenator> With a cliff-hanger from promag
299 2019-03-01T19:03:23  <meshcollider> That's a Qt issue though right
300 2019-03-01T19:03:59  <achow101> It only effects people who self compile
301 2019-03-01T19:04:26  <achow101> As the issue is with qt versions
302 2019-03-01T19:06:21  <provoostenator> It seems so, in which case it should be OK as long as we backport the fix onto the 0.18 branch.
303 2019-03-01T19:07:17  <meshcollider> Mhm
304 2019-03-01T19:07:35  <meshcollider> Other than that, yeah, we managed to get all the wallet PRs for 0.18 reviewed and merged pretty efficiently so nice work
305 2019-03-01T19:09:11  <provoostenator> Proposed topic: descriptor based wallets
306 2019-03-01T19:09:36  <provoostenator> (briefly anyway, since everyone is focussed on 0.18)
307 2019-03-01T19:11:30  <provoostenator> sipa: one thing we talked about before that would be useful for my HWW PR is away to compose descriptors in code
308 2019-03-01T19:12:01  <provoostenator> If you're able to whip up an example for e.g. sh(wpkh(xpub)) I can probably figure out the rest
309 2019-03-01T19:12:25  <provoostenator> It's just my C++ is a bit rusty when it comes to unique_ptr and abstract classes.
310 2019-03-01T19:12:38  <sipa> provoostenator: it's not that trivial anymore in the current code
311 2019-03-01T19:12:56  <sipa> i briefly had a look, but it would need some restructuring
312 2019-03-01T19:13:07  <provoostenator> Ok, glad to know it's not just me :-)
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314 2019-03-01T19:14:33  <provoostenator> The use case here is that we fetch an xpub from a hardware wallet and then construct a descriptor with that.
315 2019-03-01T19:14:45  <sipa> with the 0.18 things out of the way, i'll try to find time to do the ismine/keypool abstraction i've talked about before
316 2019-03-01T19:15:13  <provoostenator> ismine/keypool stuff also very useful.
317 2019-03-01T19:16:12  <provoostenator> An alternative approach would be to be require the hardware wallet (driver) to give a full descriptor, or a set of potential desrciptors from which we pick one or more.
318 2019-03-01T19:16:39  <meshcollider> #topic descriptor based wallets
319 2019-03-01T19:16:47  <provoostenator> But that choice shouldn't be determined by implementation details such as this I think.
320 2019-03-01T19:17:02  <sipa> provoostenator: you can always construct the descriptor in string form
321 2019-03-01T19:17:25  <sipa> i agree that's suboptimal, but it means having an API to construct descriptors shouldn't be a blocker
322 2019-03-01T19:17:47  <provoostenator> That's what I'm doing in the prototype.
323 2019-03-01T19:18:15  <instagibbs> I've done this previously as well, constructing manually
324 2019-03-01T19:18:18  <provoostenator> There's not really any blockers left in that PR, so I'm mostly focussing on getting it merge-worthy.
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326 2019-03-01T19:19:19  <provoostenator> Although it would be safer when combined with native-descriptor wallets, because the behavior of getnewaddress doesn't jive well with BIP44/49/84 that wallets use.
327 2019-03-01T19:19:45  <provoostenator> (that hardware wallets tend to use)
328 2019-03-01T19:19:55  <instagibbs> provoostenator, you're safe as long as you don't use getnewaddress with a watchonly wallet :D
329 2019-03-01T19:20:24  <meshcollider> are hardware wallets working on implementing things like returning descriptors?
330 2019-03-01T19:20:26  <provoostenator> instagibbs: so you use deriveaddresses?
331 2019-03-01T19:20:43  <instagibbs> provoostenator, no I just assume people aren't going to dust my cold wallet :P
332 2019-03-01T19:20:49  <provoostenator> meshcollider: not that I know, but HWI python coud easiliy do that.
333 2019-03-01T19:20:56  <instagibbs> meshcollider, unlikely to get that standardized, no
334 2019-03-01T19:21:15  <meshcollider> Mhm
335 2019-03-01T19:21:30  <instagibbs> ledger has basically said they won't bother supporting PSBT like ever
336 2019-03-01T19:21:42  <meshcollider> Oh, thats a shame
337 2019-03-01T19:21:43  <instagibbs> I can't imagine they'd do descriptors
338 2019-03-01T19:21:46  <sipa> well they don't need to
339 2019-03-01T19:21:52  <instagibbs> sipa, right, it's fine
340 2019-03-01T19:22:07  <instagibbs> just giving context
341 2019-03-01T19:22:09  <sipa> i mean: i wouldn't even recommend that hw wallets directly implement psbt
342 2019-03-01T19:22:18  <sipa> all you need is a software driver that supports it
343 2019-03-01T19:22:25  <sipa> same with descriptors
344 2019-03-01T19:22:36  <sipa> they're a software (and bitcoin core specifically...) kinda thing
345 2019-03-01T19:22:58  <provoostenator> Basically Bitcoin Core could give an account number and then HWI would, if the device supports SegWit return three descriptors: "pkh([44'/0'/account]xpub/0/*])", "sh(wpkh([49'/0'/account]xpub/0/*]))" and "wpkh([84'/0'/account]xpub/0/*])" (plus change), and then our wallet imports one or all
346 2019-03-01T19:23:10  <achow101> hwi already uses descriptors
347 2019-03-01T19:24:04  <provoostenator> But the current importmulti logic doesn't handle the above correctly, native descriptor wallets would.
348 2019-03-01T19:24:30  <provoostenator> So then you can get a bech32 address and it will grab it from the wpkh(84' tree, or fail if that's absent.
349 2019-03-01T19:25:45  <provoostenator> We probably only need two address types: default and wrapped-segwit. Default is either legacy pkh() or native segwith (wpkh or script hash).
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351 2019-03-01T19:26:17  <sipa> you'd mark certain records as the provider for certain types of addresses
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353 2019-03-01T19:27:43  <sipa> if you don't have one for native segwit addresses, then requesting a native segwit address will fail
354 2019-03-01T19:28:15  <provoostenator> Right, I guess it's fine to hold on to the current address_type concept then.
355 2019-03-01T19:28:29  <provoostenator> legacy, p2sh_segwit and bech32
356 2019-03-01T19:28:48  <provoostenator> But simply fail if the right descriptor isn't available.
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359 2019-03-01T19:29:27  <provoostenator> Do descriptors needs to "marked" for that? Or can you just infer it?
360 2019-03-01T19:29:50  <meshcollider> The default ones would need to be marked in case you have others too
361 2019-03-01T19:29:58  <sipa> well i'm imagining you can have multiple records
362 2019-03-01T19:32:13  <provoostenator> One default record in case there's multiple records of the same address type.
363 2019-03-01T19:32:13  <sipa> (especially if you have a wallet that at some point switched over to a new key/descriptor/hwwallet for whatever reason, but still want to keep access to old transaction history with the previous ones)
364 2019-03-01T19:32:13  <provoostenator> I was thinking of adding a purpose enum: receive, change, other
365 2019-03-01T19:32:13  <sipa> yes
366 2019-03-01T19:32:14  <provoostenator> For each address type there can only be one descriptor with receive/change
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368 2019-03-01T19:32:23  <sipa> why?
369 2019-03-01T19:32:32  <provoostenator> Because that indicates the default
370 2019-03-01T19:32:47  <sipa> what a descriptor is used for should be independent of whether it's the default imo
371 2019-03-01T19:32:54  <provoostenator> That makes sense
372 2019-03-01T19:33:06  <provoostenator> So then in addition to purpose, we also need to track the default descriptors.
373 2019-03-01T19:33:11  <sipa> if you transition to a new one, the one you used for change before doesn't stop being change
374 2019-03-01T19:33:52  <sipa> i think that's all in https://gist.github.com/sipa/125cfa1615946d0c3f3eec2ad7f250a2 already
375 2019-03-01T19:34:11  <provoostenator> How do we identify descriptors if there's more than one? Just an increasing int as we add them, or by their checksum (seems brittle) or something else?
376 2019-03-01T19:34:48  <sipa> seems like an implementation detail
377 2019-03-01T19:35:38  <provoostenator> Well, it matters for RPC arguments, but for now I'm avoiding that problem by not allowing more than one of each purpose :-)
378 2019-03-01T19:36:11  <sipa> do you need to expose internal identifiers?
379 2019-03-01T19:36:44  <sipa> (i haven't thought much about this)
380 2019-03-01T19:36:51  <meshcollider> Identify them by checksum :p
381 2019-03-01T19:37:28  <sipa> if so, it seems best that records have a unique user-provided name, and you use that name in rpc to refer to them
382 2019-03-01T19:37:31  <provoostenator> sipa: getnewaddress "Buy new cow" bech32 [how do I tell which non-default descriptor to use]
383 2019-03-01T19:37:48  <instagibbs> why not force them to switch first, then call getnewaddress
384 2019-03-01T19:37:50  <sipa> provoostenator: is that necessary?
385 2019-03-01T19:38:00  <provoostenator> Name makes sense
386 2019-03-01T19:38:08  <sipa> provoostenator: you can't getnewaddress from an old keypool now either
387 2019-03-01T19:38:21  <meshcollider> Other records are more for things like watch-only, etc
388 2019-03-01T19:38:38  <meshcollider> Internal stuff
389 2019-03-01T19:38:42  <provoostenator> True, if non-default descriptors can only be used for archival purposes then there's no need to support them in getnewaddress
390 2019-03-01T19:39:03  <sipa> that's what i was thinking yes; they're just there to not lose old transaction history
391 2019-03-01T19:39:07  <sipa> or to watch
392 2019-03-01T19:39:12  <provoostenator> It also depends on how much we want to push for 1-wallet-1-goal
393 2019-03-01T19:39:23  <provoostenator> Rather than put-whatever-you-want-in-a-single-walllet
394 2019-03-01T19:40:09  <sipa> right; but in a pure watch-only wallet (where "watch only" truly means you're watching someone else's wallet, not just "i don't have the private key right here"), you probably don't want to have any "default newaddress provider"
395 2019-03-01T19:40:15  <provoostenator> I also prefer keeping wallets simple in that sense, especially to keep the GUI sane.
396 2019-03-01T19:40:19  <sipa> because there shouldn't be a way to create new addresses
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399 2019-03-01T19:41:29  <provoostenator> Agree that getnewaddress should require >= IsSolveable
400 2019-03-01T19:41:40  <sipa> descriptors are always solvable
401 2019-03-01T19:41:59  <sipa> (except the "raw" and "script" ones, but those can't be used to derive anything anyway)
402 2019-03-01T19:42:06  <provoostenator> Ah yes
403 2019-03-01T19:42:12  <sipa> solvability is not the point
404 2019-03-01T19:42:37  <meshcollider> thats the difference between is "mine" and is "spendable"
405 2019-03-01T19:43:04  <sipa> so right now "watchonly" means "i don't happen to have the private key in my wallet.dat file"
406 2019-03-01T19:43:10  <sipa> i think that's a mistake
407 2019-03-01T19:43:44  <meshcollider> Agree, this rework is the perfect time to tighten up definition of things like that too
408 2019-03-01T19:43:45  <sipa> the distinction between "my money" and "watched money" is useful, but it's somewhat independent from where the private keys live
409 2019-03-01T19:44:23  <sipa> especially in a hwwallet/offline storage/... kinda world... the case where the private key is actually in your wallet.dat file (even for your own coins) should be the exception
410 2019-03-01T19:45:34  <sipa> oh, i guess i should bring this up here, i did a talk at SBC19 about miniscript, and i'll work on getting support for it in core
411 2019-03-01T19:45:53  <sipa> so that our signer (including psbt, etc) can deal with more complicated scripts than just single key and multisig
412 2019-03-01T19:46:46  <provoostenator> So we can do things like GreenAddress style multisig or timeout & single sig?
413 2019-03-01T19:46:50  <sipa> yeah
414 2019-03-01T19:47:16  <meshcollider> Was the talk recorded
415 2019-03-01T19:47:28  <sipa> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XM1lzN4Zfks
416 2019-03-01T19:47:34  <meshcollider> Thanks
417 2019-03-01T19:47:38  <provoostenator> I wonder what the setup UX would look like if e.g. you had two hardware wallets and wanted such a 2-of-2 or timeout & 1-of-2.
418 2019-03-01T19:47:53  <sipa> provoostenator: that's a question for you :)
419 2019-03-01T19:48:00  <sipa> i'm perfectly fine with psbt rpcs :P
420 2019-03-01T19:48:20  <instagibbs> gui coin control tho
421 2019-03-01T19:48:20  <achow101> sipa: replacing the signer with miniscript would probably be a good time to also distinguish between signing and finalizing
422 2019-03-01T19:48:32  <sipa> achow101: hmm?
423 2019-03-01T19:48:55  <provoostenator> Right, I guess there would be an RPC where you give it a meta-descriptor or miniscript, then it goes and fetches xpubs from both devices in sequence and imports the right descriptors
424 2019-03-01T19:49:11  <provoostenator> Plus asking some sanity check questions to the driver like "can you sign stuff with nlocktime"
425 2019-03-01T19:49:20  <achow101> ProduceSignature makes both the signature and scriptSig/witness
426 2019-03-01T19:49:20  <instagibbs> provoostenator, the descriptor will be parsed into miniscript, afaik
427 2019-03-01T19:49:25  <sipa> provoostenator: the workflow is that you'd use the miniscript compiler to convert a policy to a descriptor
428 2019-03-01T19:49:28  <instagibbs> ^
429 2019-03-01T19:49:29  <sipa> and then import the descriptor
430 2019-03-01T19:49:30  <instagibbs> yeah
431 2019-03-01T19:49:42  <sipa> the compiler could be built-in, but doesn't need to be
432 2019-03-01T19:49:51  <provoostenator> Do you put xpubs in the miniscript or does that happen later?
433 2019-03-01T19:50:00  <achow101> But under the psbt model, those should be distinct.
434 2019-03-01T19:50:06  <sipa> provoostenator: yeah
435 2019-03-01T19:50:17  <sipa> the compiler just passes those though, i imagine
436 2019-03-01T19:50:58  <sipa> (miniscript is just the name of the subset of script; i use "policy" language to refer to the input of the compiler)
437 2019-03-01T19:51:06  <sipa> i know, i suck at naming things
438 2019-03-01T19:51:21  <sipa> and this is genuinely confusing because there are several things that look kinda similar
439 2019-03-01T19:51:47  <provoostenator> signerfetchkeys "miniscript with rules $device_fingerprint_1  $device_fingerprint_1"
440 2019-03-01T19:51:50  <sipa> achow101: yeah, i guess it can simplify things if we split up the signer and finalizer in the code too
441 2019-03-01T19:51:53  <provoostenator> Piece of cake
442 2019-03-01T19:54:48  <meshcollider> Is there anything else anyone wants to talk about in the last few minutes
443 2019-03-01T19:58:53  <meshcollider> #endmeeting
444 2019-03-01T19:58:53  <lightningbot> Meeting ended Fri Mar  1 19:58:53 2019 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)
445 2019-03-01T19:58:53  <lightningbot> Minutes:        http://www.erisian.com.au/meetbot/bitcoin-core-dev/2019/bitcoin-core-dev.2019-03-01-19.00.html
446 2019-03-01T19:58:53  <lightningbot> Minutes (text): http://www.erisian.com.au/meetbot/bitcoin-core-dev/2019/bitcoin-core-dev.2019-03-01-19.00.txt
447 2019-03-01T19:58:53  <lightningbot> Log:            http://www.erisian.com.au/meetbot/bitcoin-core-dev/2019/bitcoin-core-dev.2019-03-01-19.00.log.html
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