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 16 2021-01-28T00:40:59  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] meshcollider pushed 2 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/d1ddead09a58...9deba2de764f
 17 2021-01-28T00:40:59  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 647b81b Ivan Metlushko: wallet, rpc: add listdescriptors command
 18 2021-01-28T00:41:00  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 9deba2d Samuel Dobson: Merge #20226: wallet, rpc: add listdescriptors command
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 21 2021-01-28T00:41:49  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] meshcollider merged pull request #20226: wallet, rpc: add listdescriptors command (master...listdescriptors) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/20226
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 26 2021-01-28T00:53:31  <dongcarl> In the meeting on the 14th, people asked jamesob and me to take a look at potential AssumeUTXO and chainman-deglobalization conflicts and if a certain merge order is preferable. Here is the result: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/19806#issuecomment-768673523
 27 2021-01-28T00:53:48  <dongcarl> The conclusion was that the PRs are mergeable in any order without much pain if the last commit of the AssumeUTXO changes in #19806 is slightly modified
 28 2021-01-28T00:53:52  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/19806 | validation: UTXO snapshot activation by jamesob · Pull Request #19806 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
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 31 2021-01-28T01:02:46  <sipa> good to know
 32 2021-01-28T01:03:16  <dongcarl> :-)
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 69 2021-01-28T03:17:45  <sob3rkid> Hey guys
 70 2021-01-28T03:17:45  <sob3rkid> I have Ios,Android,and Nodejs SDK sources on Github that develpoers might be interested in testing.
 71 2021-01-28T03:17:46  <sob3rkid> We are currently developing a bundle of custodial and non-custodial assets and a combination of each functional layer into one.
 72 2021-01-28T03:17:46  <sob3rkid> I would like to share some sample codes for testing apps
 73 2021-01-28T03:17:47  <sob3rkid> would it be okay if I release the external link of the code on this IRC group?
 74 2021-01-28T03:17:47  <sob3rkid> These are useable open-sources for developers , people could use it if they like it after testing it :)
 75 2021-01-28T03:17:48  <sob3rkid> If you are kindly allow me to share this I would be really appreciated ,
 76 2021-01-28T03:17:48  <sob3rkid> or you could  personally message me.
 77 2021-01-28T03:17:49  <sob3rkid> thank you.
 78 2021-01-28T03:18:53  <sipa> sob3rkid: this channel is for development bitcoin core, a specific implementation of the bitcoin protocol
 79 2021-01-28T03:19:27  <sob3rkid> oh, I see, my bad  thank you :)
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108 2021-01-28T05:57:50  <jamesob> dongcarl: thanks for the write-up! Will be revising the assumeutxo PR shortly
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127 2021-01-28T07:45:56  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] fctorial opened pull request #21020: Add check for gnu sed inplace replace (master...gnu_sed) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21020
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138 2021-01-28T09:05:15  <jonasschnelli> meshcollider: I think you should also add the GUI to your push mirrors when merging stuff
139 2021-01-28T09:06:14  <jonasschnelli> ^ --- ithubmerge.pushmirrors=git@github.com:bitcoin-core/gui.git
140 2021-01-28T09:06:16  <jonasschnelli> +g
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142 2021-01-28T09:08:05  <bitcoin-git> [gui] jonasschnelli merged pull request #177: Use "fusion" style on macOS Big Sur with old Qt (master...210107-style) https://github.com/bitcoin-core/gui/pull/177
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145 2021-01-28T09:08:25  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] jonasschnelli pushed 2 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/9deba2de764f...02b01651c562
146 2021-01-28T09:08:26  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 4e1154d Hennadii Stepanov: qt: Use "fusion" style on macOS Big Sur with old Qt
147 2021-01-28T09:08:27  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 02b0165 Jonas Schnelli: Merge bitcoin-core/gui#177: Use "fusion" style on macOS Big Sur with old Q...
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152 2021-01-28T09:14:59  <bitcoin-git> [gui] jonasschnelli merged pull request #72: util: Log static plugins meta data and used style (master...200812-log) https://github.com/bitcoin-core/gui/pull/72
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157 2021-01-28T09:15:44  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] jonasschnelli pushed 2 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/02b01651c562...759518354377
158 2021-01-28T09:15:44  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 957895c Hennadii Stepanov: util: Log static plugins meta data and style
159 2021-01-28T09:15:45  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 7595183 Jonas Schnelli: Merge bitcoin-core/gui#72: util: Log static plugins meta data and used sty...
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162 2021-01-28T09:17:24  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] jonasschnelli pushed 3 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/759518354377...68692d33c6c5
163 2021-01-28T09:17:24  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master b695148 Hennadii Stepanov: qt: Add flags to prevent a "What's This" button on Windows OS
164 2021-01-28T09:17:25  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master ac7ccd6 Hennadii Stepanov: scripted-diff: Remove unused "What's This" button in dialogs on Windows
165 2021-01-28T09:17:26  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 68692d3 Jonas Schnelli: Merge bitcoin-core/gui#85: Remove unused "What's This" button in dialogs o...
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168 2021-01-28T09:17:43  <bitcoin-git> [gui] jonasschnelli merged pull request #85: Remove unused "What's This" button in dialogs on Windows OS (master...200907-whatsit) https://github.com/bitcoin-core/gui/pull/85
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178 2021-01-28T10:16:04  <prayank> https://consensus-health.torproject.org/
179 2021-01-28T10:16:29  <prayank> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/20757#issuecomment-766906173
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186 2021-01-28T10:47:10  <jnewbery> It's actually impossible to load the hidden review comments in #20749. Whenever I hit the "Load more..." button it instantly fails. Looking at network capture I'm getting a 400 bad request when trying to load the extra comments.
187 2021-01-28T10:47:12  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/20749 | [Bundle 1/n] Prune g_chainman usage related to ::LookupBlockIndex by dongcarl · Pull Request #20749 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
188 2021-01-28T10:47:24  <jnewbery> github is quickly becoming unusable to do serious review
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191 2021-01-28T10:55:27  <wumpus> prayank: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/20757#issuecomment-768969585  nope nope nope nope nope
192 2021-01-28T10:56:16  <wumpus> jnewbery: that's been my experience as well
193 2021-01-28T10:56:53  <fanquake_> wumpus: lol. yea we certainly aren't about to start a Tor fork..
194 2021-01-28T10:56:56  <wumpus> jnewbery: it's starting to look like the API is the only way to use github anymore, the website adds less and less
195 2021-01-28T10:57:35  <wumpus> (this is really bad for a mostly web based product)
196 2021-01-28T10:57:58  <wumpus> fanquake_: right eh
197 2021-01-28T10:58:42  <fanquake_> jnewbery: I reported a similar issue to GitHub on the 30th of October last year. It got a reply a week later, which was basically "can't reproduce"
198 2021-01-28T11:01:23  <fanquake_> Can anyone else confirm that hitting load more in #20749 doesn't work ?
199 2021-01-28T11:01:25  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/20749 | [Bundle 1/n] Prune g_chainman usage related to ::LookupBlockIndex by dongcarl · Pull Request #20749 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
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201 2021-01-28T11:03:04  <wumpus> prayank: to be clear i would be happy if someone picked up Dandelion again, and was able to resolve the DoS issues, it has a limited an realistic enough scope, transaction broadcast
202 2021-01-28T11:04:40  <wumpus> fanquake_: same now
203 2021-01-28T11:04:49  <jnewbery> jonatack: thanks for the gh cli tip. Do you know if there's any way to also load the inline code review comments?
204 2021-01-28T11:04:51  <wumpus> i was able to load them yesterday
205 2021-01-28T11:05:01  <fanquake_> wumpus: great. Just wanted to triple check before posting heh
206 2021-01-28T11:05:10  <jnewbery> I'm just seeing the top level PR review comments
207 2021-01-28T11:05:21  <fanquake_> https://imgur.com/a/bOerpMG
208 2021-01-28T11:06:01  <fanquake_> https://0bin.net/paste/bEEMvISZ#hKXweSD5iGIyBFzjBvgF+EfugKkx9QM8ZARoHzUGh4M
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210 2021-01-28T11:06:47  <jnewbery> fanquake_: yep - that's exactly my experience
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212 2021-01-28T11:07:36  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke reopened pull request #21012: ci: Fuzz with integer sanitizer (master...2101-fuzzIntSan) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21012
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214 2021-01-28T11:08:16  <prayank> wumpus: I was trying to experiment with Dandelion and had few issues. Will try again this week and write about all the issues. One basic question was answered by 0xb10c on SE:  https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/99602/dumpmempool-and-loadmempool-in-src-validation-cpp
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216 2021-01-28T11:13:40  <wumpus> it's possible to access (https://docs.github.com/en/rest/reference/pulls#list-review-comments-in-a-repository) and even create (https://docs.github.com/en/rest/reference/pulls#create-a-review-for-a-pull-request) inline comments through the github API, the line numbers and such are available, but i checked the cli tool's docs and i can't find anything related to that
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219 2021-01-28T11:15:06  <wumpus> e.g. https://cli.github.com/manual/gh_pr_review   has nothing about specific places in the code, but might be missing someting
220 2021-01-28T11:16:41  <wumpus> https://github.com/cli/cli/issues/359 "Fine Grained Code Review Support"
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223 2021-01-28T11:21:03  <wumpus> so: currently no—it seems to less of an implementation issue but more of a matter of failing to agree on what would be a usable command line interface to this
224 2021-01-28T11:25:28  <wumpus> prayank: i keep being surprised how actually-helpful the bitcoin stackexchange is
225 2021-01-28T11:27:41  <prayank> wumpus: Not sure if I should comment on this but it's been helpful sometimes and for few things I had to ask questions on r/bitcoin and other places.
226 2021-01-28T11:28:42  <michaelfolkson> prayank: I think you forget about the questions you get answered and just focus on those that don't. Never going to get close to 100 percent success rate
227 2021-01-28T11:29:13  <prayank> lol maybe
228 2021-01-28T11:29:40  <michaelfolkson> Given it is completely voluntary it is very impressive the people that dedicate time to it
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230 2021-01-28T11:30:49  <wumpus> prayank: then i see a reddit thread and am shocked how full of distractive trolls and nonsense it is, though it definitely has it's good threads too, but the stack exchange is just so serious and people seem to really take their time to type explanations and such that are on-point
231 2021-01-28T11:32:30  <wumpus> michaelfolkson: exactly
232 2021-01-28T11:33:01  <prayank> wumpus: Agree both have their own positives. Maybe I am just overthinking about few issues and hate the options available to "close" questions on Stackexchange.
233 2021-01-28T11:33:58  <michaelfolkson> If you didn't have the moderator features you'd get the Reddit style "full of distractive trolls and nonsense"
234 2021-01-28T11:34:37  <michaelfolkson> Moderation is never perfect but it is generally pretty high quality imo
235 2021-01-28T11:34:49  <wumpus> michaelfolkson: it's kind of defined by that, yes
236 2021-01-28T11:37:36  <wumpus> prayank: anyhow yeah if you write down what the specific issues are (and what you're trying to do) others might be able to help you out, fwiw there are a fair bit of dandelion-specific threads on the stack exchange too
237 2021-01-28T11:38:08  <wumpus> you're far from the only person looking into this
238 2021-01-28T11:39:03  <wumpus> https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/81503/what-is-the-tradeoff-between-privacy-and-implementation-complexity-of-dandelion must be the most famous one
239 2021-01-28T11:41:51  <michaelfolkson> While you're here prayank, you just need to ACK the head commit, not ACK each individual commit
240 2021-01-28T11:42:00  <michaelfolkson> https://jonatack.github.io/articles/how-to-review-pull-requests-in-bitcoin-core
241 2021-01-28T11:42:23  <prayank> wumpus: I found only one thing that explains the risks involved in Dandelion on SE: https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/a/81504/ My issues are mainly related to implementation of the this commit: https://github.com/dandelion-org/bitcoin/commit/d043e36bbe9249a78cf751c80b8d876b7d9f07ea in present code's master branch because lot of things have changed since 2018
242 2021-01-28T11:42:59  <michaelfolkson> Referring to this btw https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/20757#issuecomment-768192425
243 2021-01-28T11:43:02  <wumpus> oh yes, rebasing the work on recent source code is going to be a challenge in itself
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246 2021-01-28T11:45:19  <wumpus> i think to do that you need to first understand every change, then see how it applies to master, git's source-context-based suggestions quickly become completely useless
247 2021-01-28T11:45:42  <prayank> michaelfolkson: Thanks. I had seen someone doing ACKs on individual commits so thought we can do it.
248 2021-01-28T11:46:29  <michaelfolkson> I guess if you only review one commit (or a subset of commits) then you could refer to them. But if you review all of them just ACK that head commit
249 2021-01-28T11:46:35  <wumpus> you *can* ACK invidual commits, but that's generally if you have a special reason to
250 2021-01-28T11:46:37  <wumpus> right
251 2021-01-28T11:47:24  <prayank> wumpus: Yes. Trying to understand every change and there are lot of changes.
252 2021-01-28T11:47:54  <wumpus> prayank: maybe as first pass, try to sort out which are the most important ones :)
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254 2021-01-28T11:48:56  <wumpus> there's alwasys ancillary things like refactors that were needed at the time to bring things into posistion which might no longer be needed, or needed completely differently
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256 2021-01-28T11:49:22  <prayank> Thanks. Will try and share the progress in few days.
257 2021-01-28T11:49:28  <wumpus> ok!
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260 2021-01-28T12:27:07  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] chrismaddern opened pull request #21021: Seems like time... (master...patch-1) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21021
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264 2021-01-28T12:39:22  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] fanquake closed pull request #21021: Seems like time... (master...patch-1) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21021
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290 2021-01-28T14:16:06  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke pushed 3 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/68692d33c6c5...4d5eaf7a90bc
291 2021-01-28T14:16:06  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master fa99e33 MarcoFalke: fuzz: move-only FillNode implementation to cpp file
292 2021-01-28T14:16:08  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master fad3d76 MarcoFalke: fuzz: Avoid initializing version to less than MIN_PEER_PROTO_VERSION
293 2021-01-28T14:16:08  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 4d5eaf7 MarcoFalke: Merge #20995: fuzz: Avoid initializing version to less than MIN_PEER_PROTO...
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296 2021-01-28T14:16:25  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke merged pull request #20995: fuzz: Avoid initializing version to less than MIN_PEER_PROTO_VERSION (master...2101-fuzzVersion0) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/20995
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300 2021-01-28T14:25:10  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] fanquake opened pull request #21022: [Not for merge] pthread sanity check (master...broken_shared_mutex_sanity_check) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21022
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304 2021-01-28T14:28:18  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke opened pull request #21023: fuzz: Disable shuffle when merge=1 (master...2101-fuzzMerge) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21023
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331 2021-01-28T16:44:57  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke pushed 2 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/4d5eaf7a90bc...6ba2ffd28b6b
332 2021-01-28T16:44:58  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 624091b setpill: Fix docker args conditional
333 2021-01-28T16:44:58  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 6ba2ffd MarcoFalke: Merge #21004: contrib: Fix docker args conditional in gitian-build
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336 2021-01-28T16:45:17  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke merged pull request #21004: contrib: Fix docker args conditional in gitian-build (master...improve-gitian-build-py) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21004
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338 2021-01-28T16:48:13  <MarcoFalke> #proposedmeetingtopic 0.20.2
339 2021-01-28T16:49:32  *** bitcoin-git <bitcoin-git!~bitcoin-g@x0f.org> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
340 2021-01-28T16:49:32  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke opened pull request #21024: appveyor: image: Previous Visual Studio 2019 (master...2101-ciAppveyorPrev) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21024
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342 2021-01-28T16:55:39  <dongcarl> Anyone experimented with Radicle yet and have a bitcoin-core radicle ID?
343 2021-01-28T17:04:01  <wumpus> dongcarl: yes, let me see
344 2021-01-28T17:04:33  <wumpus> dongcarl: rad:git:hwd1yreyfmyg5my7kskrsc5r33h5jr9anra9635hpncfs9f1wsk1eaf8f9w
345 2021-01-28T17:04:45  <wumpus> let me start my node too
346 2021-01-28T17:05:52  <dongcarl> I see it!
347 2021-01-28T17:08:33  *** rpite <rpite!~rpite@47.187.219.52> has quit IRC (Quit: rpite)
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349 2021-01-28T17:09:32  <dongcarl> Workflow seems quite different... I don't even see issues or PRs...
350 2021-01-28T17:13:18  <vasild> All bugs have been fixed and Bitcoin Core has no issues!
351 2021-01-28T17:13:55  *** bitcoin-git <bitcoin-git!~bitcoin-g@x0f.org> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
352 2021-01-28T17:13:55  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke closed pull request #21024: appveyor: image: Previous Visual Studio 2019 (master...2101-ciAppveyorPrev) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21024
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354 2021-01-28T17:14:49  <MarcoFalke> dongcarl: I think we still need some kind of centralized entity
355 2021-01-28T17:15:20  <MarcoFalke> I can't imagine our workflow when half the devs don't see half the pull requests
356 2021-01-28T17:15:47  <MarcoFalke> (You can only see the ones you "follow", according to the docs, haven't tried myself)
357 2021-01-28T17:17:15  <dongcarl> Right, that is the current behaviour but I can see how they can introduce "remote rebroadcasting" to solve this. Surely other projects will want the same thing.
358 2021-01-28T17:18:56  <luke-jr> MarcoFalke: at least half the devs already ignore half the PRs I suspect :P
359 2021-01-28T17:19:11  <MarcoFalke> Also, radicle doesn't work with the normal browser
360 2021-01-28T17:19:16  <luke-jr> but yes, it's probably important new devs get visibility
361 2021-01-28T17:19:19  <MarcoFalke> you need to download their own software to browse
362 2021-01-28T17:20:26  <MarcoFalke> luke-jr: Most new devs remove the word "experimental", so it would be good if no one could see those anymore. Though, rarely someone has an actual bug fix.
363 2021-01-28T17:20:30  <MarcoFalke> Same goes for issues
364 2021-01-28T17:21:35  <wumpus> dongcarl: the mirror should update every 15 minutes
365 2021-01-28T17:22:09  <wumpus> dongcarl: issues and PRs haven't been implemented in the frontend yet, unfortunately, this kind of limits its usefulness at the moment
366 2021-01-28T17:22:16  <dongcarl> Oh of course right now it's full of problems and is in alpha, I'm just thinking about a list of things still missing from radicle that perhaps can be advocated for.
367 2021-01-28T17:22:44  <luke-jr> MarcoFalke: :/
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381 2021-01-28T18:25:47  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 4 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/6ba2ffd28b6b...80e16cadd56c
382 2021-01-28T18:25:48  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master faf8356 MarcoFalke: rpc: [refactor] Use concise C++11 code in CRPCConvertTable constructor
383 2021-01-28T18:25:48  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master fa92912 MarcoFalke: rpc: Use RPCHelpMan for check-rpc-mappings linter
384 2021-01-28T18:25:49  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master fa04f9b MarcoFalke: rpc: Remove duplicate name and argNames from CRPCCommand
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387 2021-01-28T18:26:07  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj merged pull request #20012: rpc: Remove duplicate name and argNames from CRPCCommand (master...2009-rpcCheckMapping) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/20012
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390 2021-01-28T18:31:26  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] dongcarl opened pull request #21025: validation: Guard the active_chainstate with cs_main (master...2021-01-chainman-activechainstate-locking) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21025
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395 2021-01-28T19:00:39  <wumpus> #startmeeting
396 2021-01-28T19:00:49  <jonasschnelli> hi
397 2021-01-28T19:00:52  <sipa> hi
398 2021-01-28T19:00:58  <warren> hi
399 2021-01-28T19:01:01  <dongcarl> hi
400 2021-01-28T19:01:01  <achow101> hi
401 2021-01-28T19:01:02  <hebasto> h
402 2021-01-28T19:01:02  <wumpus> #bitcoin-core-dev Meeting: achow101 aj amiti ariard bluematt cfields Chris_Stewart_5 digi_james dongcarl elichai2 emilengler fanquake fjahr gleb glozow gmaxwell gwillen hebasto instagibbs jamesob jb55 jeremyrubin jl2012 jnewbery jonasschnelli jonatack jtimon kallewoof kanzure kvaciral lightlike luke-jr maaku marcofalke meshcollider michagogo moneyball morcos nehan NicolasDorier paveljanik
403 2021-01-28T19:01:04  <wumpus> petertodd phantomcircuit promag provoostenator ryanofsky sdaftuar sipa vasild wumpus
404 2021-01-28T19:01:24  <warren> I have a short suggested topic, can mention later when there's an opening.
405 2021-01-28T19:01:31  <ariard> hi
406 2021-01-28T19:01:32  <fjahr> hi
407 2021-01-28T19:01:37  <sipa> i like how wumpus doesn't even forget to call wumpus to the meeting
408 2021-01-28T19:01:39  <wumpus> no proposed meeting topics in http://gnusha.org/bitcoin-core-dev/proposedmeetingtopics.txt
409 2021-01-28T19:01:54  <michaelfolkson> hi
410 2021-01-28T19:01:57  <wumpus> sipa: hah!
411 2021-01-28T19:02:01  <jonasschnelli> heh
412 2021-01-28T19:02:12  <jnewbery> hi
413 2021-01-28T19:02:52  <wumpus> warren: do let us know so that we can announce it?
414 2021-01-28T19:03:18  *** sdaftuar <sdaftuar!~sdaftuar@gateway/tor-sasl/sdaftuar> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)
415 2021-01-28T19:03:20  <wumpus> #topic High priority for review
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417 2021-01-28T19:03:48  <ariard> may we get #19160 as a priority (multiprocess) ?
418 2021-01-28T19:03:50  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/19160 | multiprocess: Add basic spawn and IPC support by ryanofsky · Pull Request #19160 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
419 2021-01-28T19:03:50  <wumpus> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/projects/8   11 blockers, 1 bugfix, 2 chasing concept ACK
420 2021-01-28T19:03:58  <emzy> hi
421 2021-01-28T19:04:14  <ariard> it sounds finally to attract reviewers :)
422 2021-01-28T19:04:21  <warren> Suggested Topic: A bit concerning to me is Fedora is again approaching possible packaging and distribution of Bitcoin Core. While the openssl-based risk is now eliminated, I now intend to package Guix for Fedora and use that to make binary identical builds. I think I can handle the Fedora specific parts of this. But Guix for Bitcoin Core releases is still missing a few parts of what Gitian used to do?
423 2021-01-28T19:04:26  <aj> hi-ish (laggy)
424 2021-01-28T19:04:50  <jonatack> hi
425 2021-01-28T19:04:59  <wumpus> ariard: added
426 2021-01-28T19:05:05  <ariard> thanks!
427 2021-01-28T19:05:28  <wumpus> 12 blockers now! anything to add/remove or that's ready for merge?
428 2021-01-28T19:05:42  <michaelfolkson> Your #19820 is still chasing Concept ACK ariard. Keep it there or remove?
429 2021-01-28T19:05:43  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/19820 | Transactions propagation design goals · Issue #19820 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
430 2021-01-28T19:06:08  <ariard> michaelfolkson: it's not really consuming review time...
431 2021-01-28T19:06:13  <jonatack> wumpus: can rm #20391
432 2021-01-28T19:06:16  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/20391 | wallet: introduce setfeerate (an improved settxfee, in sat/vB) by jonatack · Pull Request #20391 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
433 2021-01-28T19:06:34  <wumpus> jonatack: done
434 2021-01-28T19:06:48  <jonatack> thanks (being on the blockers list doesn't attract review)
435 2021-01-28T19:07:11  <michaelfolkson> ariard: Ok. I hope to drive it forward a tiny bit at some point.
436 2021-01-28T19:07:29  <ariard> michaelfolkson: I'll try to transfer in the wiki soon and trakc all related works in this area
437 2021-01-28T19:07:31  <wumpus> jonatack: it helps for some PRs, though not all for sure
438 2021-01-28T19:08:37  <michaelfolkson> ariard: I think everyone would give it a Concept ACK but needs more than that ;)
439 2021-01-28T19:09:07  <wumpus> I didn't look into that one myself because honestly not sure about the logistics of adding another global fee setting command, it seems like something ideally set per transaction
440 2021-01-28T19:09:57  <jonatack> wumpus: it's part of a larger roadmap to migrate to sat/vB
441 2021-01-28T19:10:53  <jonatack> we can't deprecate the feeRate options in BTC/kB as long as settxfee and estimatesmartfee are only in BTC/kB
442 2021-01-28T19:11:00  <wumpus> jonatack: yes it's not specific to your PR, I generally agree with that roadmap, just something I've had a differing opinion about for a long time
443 2021-01-28T19:11:01  <jonatack> but that's ok, no worries
444 2021-01-28T19:11:50  <wumpus> anything else to discuss in regard to high prio?
445 2021-01-28T19:11:52  <aj> re 19160, it needs rebase? also is there any roadmap for libmultiprocessing, it's out of tree, but seems pretty bitcoin specific? has it really been reviewed much?
446 2021-01-28T19:12:42  <dongcarl>  #21025 is potentially a pre-req for safely doing 2 other high-prios, but happy to table that till later
447 2021-01-28T19:12:43  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/21025 | validation: Guard the active_chainstate with cs_main by dongcarl · Pull Request #21025 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
448 2021-01-28T19:12:52  <ariard> aj: it needs rebase since 12 min...
449 2021-01-28T19:12:55  <jonatack> wumpus: the idea is to make hidden/soft-deprecate settxfee and estimatesmartfee in favor of new setfeerate and estimatefeerate rpcs
450 2021-01-28T19:13:03  <wumpus> jonatack: also, introducing a new command with a new name to introduce a new unit , might be a bit overkill
451 2021-01-28T19:13:06  <ariard> but yeah libmultiprocess should be moved under bitcoin-core
452 2021-01-28T19:13:09  <wumpus> jonatack: okay
453 2021-01-28T19:13:10  <ariard> at least
454 2021-01-28T19:13:33  <wumpus> jonatack: I do agree the new names are better
455 2021-01-28T19:13:36  <jonatack> wumpus: i don't see a choice, but TBH i'm happy to close and move on to other things
456 2021-01-28T19:13:45  <jonatack> leave the migration to someone else
457 2021-01-28T19:13:52  <ariard> and yes I had a look on libmultiprocess but ofc needs more review
458 2021-01-28T19:14:01  <jonatack> we need review more than PRs to review
459 2021-01-28T19:14:14  <wumpus> jonatack: well don't let it up to me, it's just my opinion, I'm not going to get in the way
460 2021-01-28T19:14:47  <wumpus> ariard: if it needs more review, adding it to high prio for review makes sense :)
461 2021-01-28T19:15:19  <wumpus> jonatack: what does achow101 think about it?
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463 2021-01-28T19:15:30  <sipa> jonatack: i think it's really the only convenient option to get an RPC with sat/vB units, so seems fine to me
464 2021-01-28T19:15:40  <jonatack> achow101 wrote that they should all be in sat/vB
465 2021-01-28T19:16:25  <wumpus> ok ,good
466 2021-01-28T19:16:32  <jonatack> sipa: ok. anyway, no rush. we have lots to do.
467 2021-01-28T19:16:38  <sipa> this is true
468 2021-01-28T19:16:49  <wumpus> absolutely
469 2021-01-28T19:16:59  <wumpus> not many topics for this meeting though, let's go to warren 's
470 2021-01-28T19:17:07  <luke-jr> jonatack: I wouldn't close it tho
471 2021-01-28T19:17:14  <wumpus> #topic Fedora packaging (warren)
472 2021-01-28T19:17:21  <warren> A bit concerning to me is Fedora is again approaching possible packaging and distribution of Bitcoin Core. While the openssl-based risk is now eliminated, I now intend to package Guix for Fedora and use that to make binary identical builds. I think I can handle the Fedora specific parts of this. But Guix for Bitcoin Core releases is still missing a few parts of what Gitian used to do?
473 2021-01-28T19:17:25  <warren> I will not be able to stop them from distributing not-deterministic Bitcoin Core for much longer.
474 2021-01-28T19:17:30  <warren> Maybe TODO List?
475 2021-01-28T19:17:30  <warren> 1) Bitcoin Core switch to Guix for release builds (when possible ... Guix is missing some of the architectures?) I believe we want a replacement for what Gitian used to do including exporting a particular tag from git, naming and versioning the output tarballs, anything else?
476 2021-01-28T19:17:37  <warren> 2) Guix to additionally output .deb and .rpm packages that contain the same binary as the tarball.
477 2021-01-28T19:17:37  <warren> 3) Debian Unstable now ships Guix. Warren is working on figuring out a way to package Guix so it would be acceptable for Fedora where it would be capable of building the above for Fedora/CentOS direct distribution.
478 2021-01-28T19:18:18  <luke-jr> warren: distro packages *shouldn't* be identical to release binaries, but deterministic certainly does seem desirable
479 2021-01-28T19:18:34  <luke-jr> warren: the problems with distro pkgs were discussed at the last meeting regarding Debian (which has chosen to ignore them)
480 2021-01-28T19:18:35  <dongcarl> Status update on Guix from me: all architectures are packaged, codesigning is the main remaining task
481 2021-01-28T19:18:52  <warren> luke-jr: Fedora can't do deterministic with its own build system anytime soon, using Guix there and here is the achievable goal in the short-term.
482 2021-01-28T19:18:59  <achow101> dongcarl: codesigning is easy now
483 2021-01-28T19:19:03  <warren> dongcarl: *all*? amazing!
484 2021-01-28T19:19:11  <luke-jr> warren: sure, that's fine - but they should dynamic link to most libraries
485 2021-01-28T19:19:19  <achow101> codesigning is also unreltaed to linux distros
486 2021-01-28T19:19:29  <dongcarl> right
487 2021-01-28T19:19:46  <warren> luke-jr: I believe that's an opinion not shared by most others?
488 2021-01-28T19:19:51  *** virtu <virtu!~virtu@gateway/tor-sasl/virtu> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
489 2021-01-28T19:19:58  <luke-jr> warren: dunno, if not, they're wrong ;)
490 2021-01-28T19:20:23  <luke-jr> LevelDB is the one exception that might justify static linking
491 2021-01-28T19:20:25  <wumpus> i'm for 100% static release binaries
492 2021-01-28T19:20:34  <luke-jr> (in distro packages)
493 2021-01-28T19:20:45  <warren> dongcarl: so this soon to be process eliminates gitian? is there something to handle naming and versioning outputs like gitian used to do?
494 2021-01-28T19:21:02  <luke-jr> warren: it can't eliminate gitian..
495 2021-01-28T19:21:04  <dongcarl> warren: The output naming scheme is exactly Gitian's
496 2021-01-28T19:21:10  <warren> dongcarl: can this work entirely offline with provided pre-cached downloads? That's one of the requirements of Fedora's build system
497 2021-01-28T19:21:14  <luke-jr> Guix requires a trusted bootstrap
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499 2021-01-28T19:21:37  <sipa> luke-jr: you trust the system you're building on, no?
500 2021-01-28T19:22:02  <luke-jr> sipa: yes, but Guix wants me to trust <random third party binaries>
501 2021-01-28T19:22:19  <dongcarl> luke-jr: Is gitian different?
502 2021-01-28T19:22:28  <MarcoFalke> luke-jr: Just use a vm
503 2021-01-28T19:22:36  <luke-jr> dongcarl: gitian runs all untrusted bins in a VM
504 2021-01-28T19:22:36  <wumpus> guix is an improvement to gitian in that regard, that's all
505 2021-01-28T19:22:40  <luke-jr> MarcoFalke: that's what gitian is for ;)
506 2021-01-28T19:22:42  <wumpus> you can run guix in a vm
507 2021-01-28T19:22:48  <luke-jr> Guix *within* gitian is an improvement
508 2021-01-28T19:22:49  <wumpus> you can run guix in gitian even
509 2021-01-28T19:22:51  <wumpus> :-)
510 2021-01-28T19:22:53  <luke-jr> Guix *without* gitian is a regression
511 2021-01-28T19:23:01  <wumpus> well that's entirely up to you
512 2021-01-28T19:23:08  <wumpus> guix doesn't care what you run it in
513 2021-01-28T19:23:10  <wumpus> that's thepoint
514 2021-01-28T19:23:13  <warren> dongcarl: can this new glorious gitianless future work entirely offline with provided pre-cached downloads? That's one of the requirements of Fedora's build system
515 2021-01-28T19:23:13  <MarcoFalke> luke-jr: You are free to use guix in gitian, but you can't force everyone else to do the same
516 2021-01-28T19:23:25  <warren> MarcoFalke: +1
517 2021-01-28T19:24:04  <achow101> I agree with luke-jr for a different reason. I think gitian is an easier way to onboard new gitian builders, and existing gitian builders don't need to change anything for guix. So we should still have gitian descriptors that do the guix builds. People who want guix locally can do that too. It should all be the same.
518 2021-01-28T19:24:07  <dongcarl> warren: Yes, I believe it's designed to do so. I will double-check
519 2021-01-28T19:24:25  <warren> achow101: that's fine
520 2021-01-28T19:24:39  <sipa> achow101: yeah, i'd expect we'll just change the gitian descriptors to be thin wrappers around guix
521 2021-01-28T19:24:44  <sipa> but no reason they can't remain
522 2021-01-28T19:24:45  <warren> if people find it more convenient to use it that way
523 2021-01-28T19:24:55  <luke-jr> sipa: +1
524 2021-01-28T19:24:59  <wumpus> mind that gitian is effectively unmaintained
525 2021-01-28T19:25:02  <MarcoFalke> achow101: guix is included in debian, so it will be in Ubuntu soon. I don't see how another wrapper makes things easier
526 2021-01-28T19:25:29  <achow101> MarcoFalke: I already have gitian setup and can't be bothered to figure out gitian :p
527 2021-01-28T19:25:39  <achow101> * figure out guix
528 2021-01-28T19:25:47  <luke-jr> MarcoFalke: we should not be asking people to run third-party binaries on their system to build releases
529 2021-01-28T19:26:04  <MarcoFalke> luke-jr: Then they should be using a vm
530 2021-01-28T19:26:06  <wumpus> and it has some long-running issues, like the inability to upgrade base images leading to very long setup+build times
531 2021-01-28T19:26:10  <luke-jr> MarcoFalke: yes
532 2021-01-28T19:26:32  <MarcoFalke> luke-jr: The gitian guide starts by telling people how to install the vm, so nothing changes
533 2021-01-28T19:26:32  <luke-jr> wumpus: gitian's last merge was only a month ago, hardly unmaintained..
534 2021-01-28T19:26:33  <dongcarl> Is the main benefit here just a convenience script for running guix in a VM, or that people are used to the Gitian workflow?
535 2021-01-28T19:26:40  <wumpus> then again, i'm tired of this discussion every time, if you want to use gitian then do...
536 2021-01-28T19:27:08  <wumpus> i don't think it should be the default recommendation or 'a good way to onboard new builders'
537 2021-01-28T19:27:15  <sipa> gitian does a few things that guix doesn't, i assume (like the creation of assert files, signing, verifying them)?
538 2021-01-28T19:27:21  <wumpus> just make guix easy to use please
539 2021-01-28T19:27:33  <wumpus> sipa: there is no reason why the guix wrapper couldn't do that
540 2021-01-28T19:27:41  <sipa> wumpus: of course
541 2021-01-28T19:27:52  <dongcarl> making guix easy to use is very much my goal
542 2021-01-28T19:28:03  <wumpus> generating assert files is quite easy, signing them is done by gnupg
543 2021-01-28T19:28:08  <wumpus> dongcarl: right!
544 2021-01-28T19:28:35  <wumpus> and verifying them can be done without gitian now, e.g. see the gitian-verify.py script in maintainer-tools
545 2021-01-28T19:28:41  <sipa> ok!
546 2021-01-28T19:28:42  <warren> luke-jr: you can bootstrap guix yourself, why are you calling it untrusted?
547 2021-01-28T19:28:50  <luke-jr> warren: no, I cannot
548 2021-01-28T19:28:56  <luke-jr> warren: I spent hours trying and couldn't get anywhere
549 2021-01-28T19:29:02  <MarcoFalke> warren: What is the policy for packages that are EOL? What is the policy for packages that went from fedora->stream->rhel?
550 2021-01-28T19:29:08  <wumpus> I mean the whole point is that guix relies on a smaller trusted base than gitian
551 2021-01-28T19:29:32  <warren> MarcoFalke: i need to ask what is possible from Fedora Engineering Steering Committee. I have a few things in mind like:
552 2021-01-28T19:29:33  <aj> MarcoFalke: bitcoin's not going in stream/rhel, surely
553 2021-01-28T19:29:36  <wumpus> gitian installs an *ubuntu* VM, it has lots of cruft
554 2021-01-28T19:29:59  <luke-jr> wumpus: Guix is a smaller trusted base than Ubuntu, but larger than gitian for the host end
555 2021-01-28T19:30:00  <warren> 1) Before a distro goes EOL the bitcoincore package is replaced with a final update that removes the binary.
556 2021-01-28T19:30:27  <warren> 2) Build system CI could verify that the binary is reproducible and matches some URL upstream.
557 2021-01-28T19:30:36  <wumpus> luke-jr: otoh if the guix trusted base is compromised so will the bitcoin core binaries
558 2021-01-28T19:30:42  <luke-jr> warren: how about automatic upgrades and softforks? both deploying and not deploying the softfork are problematic without user consent
559 2021-01-28T19:30:45  <sipa> wumpus: i think luke-jr's concern is about the risk that guix is malicious and say install malware in his host system; not about trusting the result of the build
560 2021-01-28T19:30:49  <wumpus> luke-jr: it's kind of important
561 2021-01-28T19:30:55  <wumpus> same for ubuntu right now, btw
562 2021-01-28T19:30:56  <MarcoFalke> aj: shoudn't or can't?
563 2021-01-28T19:30:58  * dongcarl is here but is a bit overwhelmed by the convo
564 2021-01-28T19:31:09  <warren> luke-jr: why are you blindly trusting Ubuntu right now?
565 2021-01-28T19:31:19  <wumpus> one compromised package in ubuntu and our binaries can be compromised
566 2021-01-28T19:31:26  <aj> MarcoFalke: won't / isn't a rhel priority so doesn't make sense?
567 2021-01-28T19:31:27  <wumpus> this is kind of scary
568 2021-01-28T19:31:27  * warren hands dongcarl a calming Tribble.
569 2021-01-28T19:31:35  <luke-jr> wumpus: yes, but we already have that problem
570 2021-01-28T19:31:40  * sipa googles Tribble
571 2021-01-28T19:31:52  <wumpus> luke-jr: it is mitigated by guix
572 2021-01-28T19:31:55  <luke-jr> (with Ubuntu)
573 2021-01-28T19:31:58  <MarcoFalke> aj: Oh, I assumed they just take all packages from fedora
574 2021-01-28T19:32:36  <wumpus> because guix has a smaller trusted base, sure, it still has some binaries for bootstrapping, n one really solved the trusting-trust attacks yet, we can only slowly improve things
575 2021-01-28T19:32:47  <luke-jr> wumpus: the ideal solution would be a way to bootstrap Guix without the third-party binary blobs
576 2021-01-28T19:32:58  <warren> luke-jr does have a legitimate question about automatic upgrades. It is upstream's policy to not force users into automatic upgrades. If you install a distro package you opt-in to that.
577 2021-01-28T19:33:00  <wumpus> luke-jr: i'm sure that's possible
578 2021-01-28T19:33:21  <warren> There is a way however for users to opt-out of automatic distro upgrades.
579 2021-01-28T19:33:23  <wumpus> guix is fully open source right? why couldn't you bootstrap it from an existing system?
580 2021-01-28T19:33:37  <wumpus> givn that you have compilers and such of course
581 2021-01-28T19:33:43  *** luke-jr <luke-jr!~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr> has quit IRC (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net)
582 2021-01-28T19:33:53  <warren> well that's one way to win the debate
583 2021-01-28T19:33:55  <achow101> wumpus: from my experience, there are some usability hurdles that can make setting up guix really frustrating
584 2021-01-28T19:34:12  <wumpus> achow101: well then we need to solve them
585 2021-01-28T19:34:13  <aj> warren: nah, he got too close to telling the truth, so the powers that be deplatformed him
586 2021-01-28T19:34:25  <wumpus> i don't see why that's an argument in favor of wrapping guix in ubuntu forever
587 2021-01-28T19:34:32  <sipa> it isn't
588 2021-01-28T19:34:34  <warren> achow101: people downloading a guix VM is no worse than people blindly trusting Ubuntu in current gitian.
589 2021-01-28T19:34:54  <dongcarl> I'm happy to solve all of the usability problems in setting up Guix, that was an explicit goal from the beginning. To make it easier to use.
590 2021-01-28T19:35:00  <sipa> yay.
591 2021-01-28T19:35:13  <aj> dongcarl: <3
592 2021-01-28T19:35:38  <dongcarl> Bootstrapping Guix from source is not the most user-friendly, but the UX problems are being solved, and the recent debian packaging outlines a for-sure way to bootstrap it from a system
593 2021-01-28T19:35:42  <MarcoFalke> warren: Also, who would maintain the fedora package?
594 2021-01-28T19:35:43  <warren> There is a way however for users to opt-out of automatic distro upgrades. The .rpm distributed by bitcoincore.org would be identical to the package distributed by Fedora except the Epoch number is higher. That way the Fedora package will never be seen as "newer". It retains the property desired by Bitcoin Core project that nobody is forced into automatic upgrades.
595 2021-01-28T19:36:05  <warren> MarcoFalke: me, and everyone, because I intend it to be identical to bitcoincore.org's guix generated .rpm
596 2021-01-28T19:36:15  *** luke-jr <luke-jr!~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
597 2021-01-28T19:36:17  <wumpus> fwiw gitian is also not the most user friendly, it helps that there's guides for it everywhere now, but it took ages for people to start using it
598 2021-01-28T19:36:45  <dongcarl> I'm sure that the debian packaging rules/formula can be ported to other distros, such as Gentoo, so that people on those distros can stay within their trusted base and boostrap Guix
599 2021-01-28T19:36:46  <sipa> i don't even invoke anything gitian related directly, all within perhaps several layers of wrapper scripts
600 2021-01-28T19:37:33  <wumpus> in a way it's just a matter of getting used to a new way of working, i don't think we need to wait for guix to be 100% user friendly all over the board until we can start using it for release builds
601 2021-01-28T19:38:03  *** luke-jr <luke-jr!~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr> has quit IRC (Excess Flood)
602 2021-01-28T19:38:08  <jonatack> this ^
603 2021-01-28T19:38:08  <warren> gitian is already not user friendly, it's been mostly broken for me for a few years now.
604 2021-01-28T19:38:23  <sipa> agree
605 2021-01-28T19:38:27  <wumpus> warren: exactly my point, gitian was never easy to use or set up
606 2021-01-28T19:38:30  <achow101> true
607 2021-01-28T19:38:54  <dongcarl> I am also happy to offer my time to 1. Help anyone with their setup 2. Document UX hiccups 3. Fix them so that others don't experience them
608 2021-01-28T19:38:55  <wumpus> it's just fairly well documented now, that will happen for guix too i'm sure when we start using it
609 2021-01-28T19:39:00  <MarcoFalke> Are we aiming to ship guix packages for the next release?
610 2021-01-28T19:39:05  <warren> If people want easy to use guix they can download a VM. That isn't worse than the current blind trust on Ubuntu used within gitian.
611 2021-01-28T19:39:22  <wumpus> warren: at least you have more flexibility in what VM then!
612 2021-01-28T19:39:44  <sipa> dongcarl: how realistic do you think it is to replace all release binaries for 22.0 with guix-built ones?
613 2021-01-28T19:39:52  <wumpus> it doesn't need to be ubuntu anymore, can be debian, or even a guix-as-a-distro VM
614 2021-01-28T19:40:17  <jonatack> warren: we've onboarded a dozen or so new gitian signers the past 6 months, by (a) making it a bit easier to get started and (b) communicating a bit more about doing it to people
615 2021-01-28T19:40:31  <jonatack> i'm sure can do the same with guix
616 2021-01-28T19:40:48  <dongcarl> sipa, MarcoFalke: The missing steps before we ship 22 with guix are: codesigning, assert-file tooling, UX/non-UX debugging and testing
617 2021-01-28T19:40:51  <warren> How difficult are the remaining things needed to switch to guix/
618 2021-01-28T19:40:52  <warren> ?
619 2021-01-28T19:41:14  <MarcoFalke> dongcarl: Would those be easier if the gitian setup was used?
620 2021-01-28T19:41:28  <dongcarl> I don't expect codesigning and assert-file tooling to be too difficult, but I don't want to make any promises w/re UX/non-UX debugging and testing
621 2021-01-28T19:41:34  <MarcoFalke> I.e. replace the gitian build script with a guix build script, but still call gitian
622 2021-01-28T19:41:55  <dongcarl> MarcoFalke: No, I believe using the gitian setup will probably be much more difficult
623 2021-01-28T19:42:03  <warren> dongcarl: fedora builds have things neat thing where .rpm contains stripped binaries, but unstripped go into an optional -debuginfo package. gdb is smart enough to look at the debuginfo if you debug. Does guix have anything like that?
624 2021-01-28T19:42:09  <dongcarl> s/much more/a bit/
625 2021-01-28T19:42:24  <wumpus> there's still 4.5 months left before the 22.0 feature freeze
626 2021-01-28T19:42:48  <warren> Could we do a practice release using guix of 0.21?
627 2021-01-28T19:42:52  <MarcoFalke> If we switch, I'd prefer to do it at least two months before freeze
628 2021-01-28T19:43:09  <warren> 0.21.x
629 2021-01-28T19:43:19  *** luke-jr <luke-jr!~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
630 2021-01-28T19:43:21  <sipa> dongcarl: what do you mean with "UX/non-UX debugging" ?
631 2021-01-28T19:43:21  <wumpus> nack on wrapping guix in gitian, i really don't want to do a build like that
632 2021-01-28T19:43:27  <warren> wumpus: +1
633 2021-01-28T19:43:41  <wumpus> this almost doubles the trusted base
634 2021-01-28T19:44:11  <dongcarl> Okay, I've been deep in the libbitcoin_kernel work as of late. But let me reload my stack, explore the scope, and get back to you all with my rough timeline expectations next week. Does that sound alright?
635 2021-01-28T19:44:14  *** pinheadmz <pinheadmz!~pinheadmz@pool-71-105-114-182.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has quit IRC (Quit: pinheadmz)
636 2021-01-28T19:44:21  <wumpus> dongcarl: thanks!
637 2021-01-28T19:44:37  <warren> How difficult is it to write the remaining tooling needed to switch releases to guix? If we don't know the answer right now can we have a TODO list by next meeting?
638 2021-01-28T19:44:50  *** ghost43_ <ghost43_!~daer@gateway/tor-sasl/daer> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)
639 2021-01-28T19:45:07  *** ghost43 <ghost43!~daer@gateway/tor-sasl/daer> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
640 2021-01-28T19:45:34  <wumpus> how can we help?
641 2021-01-28T19:45:39  <dongcarl> sipa: UX debugging would be going through the process to see which parts are non-intuitive and hard to use. non-UX debugging would entail testing the build output result more thoroughly
642 2021-01-28T19:46:12  <warren> dongcarl: isn't that the same problem we have with the gitian release process?
643 2021-01-28T19:46:16  <warren> not a new problem
644 2021-01-28T19:46:19  <sipa> dongcarl: i'd expect the former can be alleviated by just writing documentation
645 2021-01-28T19:46:36  <sipa> and perhaps in later steps make it more user friendly, so less needs to be documented
646 2021-01-28T19:46:36  <MarcoFalke> do we need any assert-file tooling?
647 2021-01-28T19:46:47  * dongcarl furiously typing
648 2021-01-28T19:46:56  <MarcoFalke> As I understand the assert-file will list the installed ubuntu packages, but we no longer use that
649 2021-01-28T19:47:13  <wumpus> what would a guix assert file even look like? just a list of hashes of the release files? or would you want to include more?
650 2021-01-28T19:47:25  <wumpus> MarcoFalke: right, that
651 2021-01-28T19:47:36  <achow101> shoudl the assert file even try to look like gitian's?
652 2021-01-28T19:47:49  <wumpus> achow101: no reason it needs to
653 2021-01-28T19:47:56  <MarcoFalke> so a sha256sum with a wildcard would generate the "assert file"?
654 2021-01-28T19:47:57  <achow101> I would expect the guix assert file would be everything installed in guix
655 2021-01-28T19:48:00  <sipa> if it's not guix-in-gitian, i see no reason why the assert file needs to be anything similar
656 2021-01-28T19:48:04  <dongcarl> You're right, it doesn't need to.
657 2021-01-28T19:48:13  <wumpus> it's fine with me if the assert file loks like SHA256SUMS.asc
658 2021-01-28T19:48:30  * luke-jr kicks ISP
659 2021-01-28T19:48:34  <sipa> it's nice if it also commits to the exact source code it was built from
660 2021-01-28T19:48:56  <dongcarl> Here's the way fanquake and I have been verifying our outputs: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/17920#issuecomment-765109583
661 2021-01-28T19:48:57  <wumpus> sipa: true!
662 2021-01-28T19:49:14  <dongcarl> Literally a one-liner
663 2021-01-28T19:49:17  <wumpus> ideally it could commit to the inputs as well as the outputs
664 2021-01-28T19:49:34  <dongcarl> Since that one-liner includes src/bitcoin-f1694757ddbc.tar.gz, it does commit to the bitcoin source
665 2021-01-28T19:49:37  <luke-jr> it would be nice if as a result from this, we can dump everyone's signatures into the SHA256SUMS.asc file on the website
666 2021-01-28T19:49:53  <MarcoFalke> dongcarl: Is the commit included when building tags?
667 2021-01-28T19:50:15  <dongcarl> MarcoFalke: Sorry, not entirely sure what you mean here
668 2021-01-28T19:50:26  <wumpus> luke-jr: that was my thinking as well
669 2021-01-28T19:50:39  <dongcarl> luke-jr: That would be nice! I'll make a note of that
670 2021-01-28T19:50:46  <MarcoFalke> when building a tag, the archive looks like `bitcoin-22.0.tar.gz`, not `bitcoin-fffffff.targ.gz`
671 2021-01-28T19:51:01  <wumpus> everyone would be signing the same data so you could combine the signatures
672 2021-01-28T19:51:13  <luke-jr> I wrote a blog post about verifying gitian sigs - it was way more complex than I'd like
673 2021-01-28T19:51:30  <dongcarl> MarcoFalke: Yes, I believe I made sure of that some time ago, will re-check for you!
674 2021-01-28T19:51:59  <wumpus> luke-jr: have you seen https://github.com/bitcoin-core/bitcoin-maintainer-tools#gitian-verify ? it makes things much easier
675 2021-01-28T19:52:10  <wumpus> (e.g. tabulates the result)
676 2021-01-28T19:52:29  <luke-jr> wumpus: that assumes the end user already has it ;)
677 2021-01-28T19:52:39  <MarcoFalke> Though, since guix only works from git, including the commit hash in the "assert file" shouldn't be too hard
678 2021-01-28T19:52:45  <wumpus> luke-jr: already has what?
679 2021-01-28T19:52:57  <luke-jr> wumpus: a trusted Bitcoin Core source repo
680 2021-01-28T19:53:28  <luke-jr> or rather, the maintainer tools repo
681 2021-01-28T19:53:42  <wumpus> well okay sure, if you want to do it all manually
682 2021-01-28T19:53:47  <wumpus> that's definitely a lot of work
683 2021-01-28T19:53:57  <luke-jr> wget https://luke.dashjr.org/programs/bitcoin/files/bitcoind/0.21.0/SHA256SUMS.asc && gpg --verify SHA256SUMS.asc
684 2021-01-28T19:53:59  <luke-jr> is a lot less
685 2021-01-28T19:54:15  <luke-jr> (sha256sum -c too I guess)
686 2021-01-28T19:54:46  <wumpus> i mean, sure, but that still assumes someone has all the gpg keys received and installed, but yeah
687 2021-01-28T19:55:11  <wumpus> any other topics?
688 2021-01-28T19:55:13  <warren> Question ... since 0.22 is months away could we aim to do a practice release on 0.21.x?
689 2021-01-28T19:55:23  <luke-jr> WOT issues are unavoidable and not going away XD
690 2021-01-28T19:55:45  <wumpus> warren: i would prefer to start using guix only in a major release
691 2021-01-28T19:55:46  <MarcoFalke> wumpus: My topic was 0.20.2 :)
692 2021-01-28T19:56:05  <warren> wumpus: not official for 0.21.x, but in parallel
693 2021-01-28T19:56:19  <sipa> warren: or just master?
694 2021-01-28T19:56:21  <warren> wumpus: partly because I need it to calm down the Fedora packagers
695 2021-01-28T19:56:22  <MarcoFalke> warren: I think we can also practice on master
696 2021-01-28T19:56:23  <sipa> why backport?
697 2021-01-28T19:56:24  <wumpus> it's too big a change to backport, and besides, it needs the more extensive rc cycle of a major release
698 2021-01-28T19:56:37  <warren> hmm
699 2021-01-28T19:56:42  <wumpus> yes, practicing can be done fine on master
700 2021-01-28T19:56:54  <warren> I'll live with that.
701 2021-01-28T19:56:58  <sipa> or, on the guix PR branch, as long as it's not merged
702 2021-01-28T19:56:59  <dongcarl> I'd be happy to practice with anyone and take notes :-)
703 2021-01-28T19:57:02  <wumpus> #topic 0.20.2 (MarcoFalke)
704 2021-01-28T19:57:14  <MarcoFalke> Basically asking if anything is left to do there
705 2021-01-28T19:57:30  <MarcoFalke> and whether to do an rc and upload binaries
706 2021-01-28T19:57:31  <wumpus> no idea, haven't kept track
707 2021-01-28T19:58:44  <MarcoFalke> the rc1 was never released?
708 2021-01-28T19:58:46  <luke-jr> MarcoFalke: I did end up finding a bug in the 0.19 bump
709 2021-01-28T19:58:56  <luke-jr> sorry I missed the rcs
710 2021-01-28T19:59:03  <MarcoFalke> luke-jr: huh?
711 2021-01-28T19:59:12  * luke-jr digs it out to see if it's relevant to 0.20
712 2021-01-28T19:59:45  <wumpus> I think it would be good if someone took over the back-releases from me, i do not have the capacity to handle that, definitely not so many at the same time
713 2021-01-28T20:00:03  <luke-jr> I thought MarcoFalke was?
714 2021-01-28T20:00:20  <MarcoFalke> I create the backports
715 2021-01-28T20:00:22  <wumpus> yes, he effectively does
716 2021-01-28T20:00:29  <wumpus> already
717 2021-01-28T20:00:40  <MarcoFalke> Haven't run any of the release stuff scripts
718 2021-01-28T20:00:43  <luke-jr> MarcoFalke: aha, it was a libevent dep for just bitcoin-tx builds
719 2021-01-28T20:01:09  <luke-jr> I think it was fixed before 0.20
720 2021-01-28T20:01:40  <luke-jr> so n/a for 0.20.2, and 0.19 will probably be dead before there's a chance to do another
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722 2021-01-28T20:02:52  <wumpus> #endmeeting
723 2021-01-28T20:02:55  <MarcoFalke> luke-jr: 0.19 won't get any gitian binaries published, as I understood it
724 2021-01-28T20:03:11  <luke-jr> ? this is when building from source
725 2021-01-28T20:03:46  <wumpus> feel free to open a PR against the 0.19 branch to fix it then
726 2021-01-28T20:08:20  <sipa> luke-jr: can i have a BIP number for bip-bech32m? (there are a few other things in the bips repo that want your attention too, i think)
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729 2021-01-28T20:12:19  <luke-jr> sipa: I guess use 350
730 2021-01-28T20:13:08  <sipa> luke-jr: thanks!
731 2021-01-28T20:21:09  *** bitcoin-git <bitcoin-git!~bitcoin-g@x0f.org> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
732 2021-01-28T20:21:09  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj opened pull request #21026: doc: Document use of make-tag script to make tags (master...2021-01-make-tag) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21026
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734 2021-01-28T20:24:15  <wumpus> ^^ might be useful if anyone else is to have a go at making releases
735 2021-01-28T20:33:11  <achow101> is it possible to remove a task from CScheduler or maybe pause one?
736 2021-01-28T20:36:35  <wumpus> doesn't seem like it
737 2021-01-28T20:40:03  <sipsorcery> MarcoFalke: Did you change anything on the appveyor config? Or did one job just magically work again?
738 2021-01-28T20:51:06  <dongcarl> For those following along the assumeutxo/chainman-deglobalizing work, please take a look at this very short PR which aims to remove the m_active_chainstate r/w footgun: #21025
739 2021-01-28T20:51:07  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/21025 | validation: Guard the active_chainstate with cs_main by dongcarl · Pull Request #21025 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
740 2021-01-28T20:52:10  <dongcarl> This is a prerequisite to having both work be safe, and I hope is simple enough to get in relatively quickly to unblock the two high-prio PRs
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744 2021-01-28T21:25:00  <luke-jr> MarcoFalke: can you please upstream https://github.com/bitcoin-core/univalue/pull/24 ?
745 2021-01-28T21:29:27  <wumpus> dongcarl: thanks for working in that
746 2021-01-28T21:29:30  <wumpus> on*
747 2021-01-28T21:29:57  <dongcarl> :-)
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749 2021-01-28T21:44:16  *** bitcoin-git <bitcoin-git!~bitcoin-g@x0f.org> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
750 2021-01-28T21:44:17  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 5 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/80e16cadd56c...6a726cb534ed
751 2021-01-28T21:44:17  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 798bc0b Luke Dashjr: Support glibc-back-compat on 64-bit POWER
752 2021-01-28T21:44:18  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 63fc2b1 Luke Dashjr: gitian: Properly quote arguments in wrappers
753 2021-01-28T21:44:18  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 00f67c8 Luke Dashjr: gitian-linux: Build binaries for 64-bit POWER
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755 2021-01-28T21:44:36  *** bitcoin-git <bitcoin-git!~bitcoin-g@x0f.org> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
756 2021-01-28T21:44:37  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj merged pull request #20963: gitian-linux: Build binaries for 64-bit POWER (continued) (master...2021-01-power) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/20963
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758 2021-01-28T21:45:30  <sipa> POWER, unlimited POWER!
759 2021-01-28T21:49:22  * warren imagines beard stroking.
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763 2021-01-28T22:11:04  <wumpus> hehe "64-bit POWER" sounds a bit like some cheesy early AMD64 commercial
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765 2021-01-28T22:15:54  <sipa> brings back memories of nintendo64
766 2021-01-28T22:16:20  <sipa> where a "64" suffix was used in way too many places
767 2021-01-28T22:16:20  <luke-jr> was that POWER?
768 2021-01-28T22:16:27  <sipa> MIPS, i think
769 2021-01-28T22:16:32  <luke-jr> 64-bit MIPS?
770 2021-01-28T22:16:37  <luke-jr> does that even exist?
771 2021-01-28T22:17:56  <sipa> apparently it did in 1996
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778 2021-01-28T23:14:44  <wumpus> IIRC nintendo64 didn't have an actual 64 bit processor, but two 32 bit ones
779 2021-01-28T23:15:59  <phantomcircuit> wumpus, it was a hybrid, there were 64bit instructions
780 2021-01-28T23:16:03  <phantomcircuit> iirc they were not useful
781 2021-01-28T23:16:30  <wumpus> okay
782 2021-01-28T23:17:47  <phantomcircuit> wumpus, no im wrong it's a true 64bit cpu but with a 32bit system bus... so nobody used the 64bit operations
783 2021-01-28T23:19:01  <wumpus> i was confused with a different console then, i'm fairly sure the trick i mentioned was used somewhere
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792 2021-01-28T23:36:22  <bitcoin-git> [gui] jonatack opened pull request #201: gui: ensure inbound block relay peers have relevant services (master...inbound-block-relay) https://github.com/bitcoin-core/gui/pull/201
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