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  292021-03-25T03:39:07  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] fanquake pushed 2 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/ed49203daabb...8f94c70625eb
  302021-03-25T03:39:07  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master ec76bad Hennadii Stepanov: build, qt: Fix static builds on macOS Big Sur
  312021-03-25T03:39:08  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 8f94c70 fanquake: Merge #21495: build, qt: Fix static builds on macOS Big Sur
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  342021-03-25T03:39:26  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] fanquake merged pull request #21495: build, qt: Fix static builds on macOS Big Sur (master...210321-layer) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21495
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  412021-03-25T03:53:48  <SuViVoR> i want to get started with development
  422021-03-25T03:53:57  <SuViVoR> anyway i can help out?
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  442021-03-25T04:06:12  <phantomcircuit> SuViVoR, there's issues tagged 'good first issue'
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  522021-03-25T04:16:49  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] ajtowns opened pull request #21527: NOMERGE: net_processing: orphan handling changes  (master...202102-orphanworkset) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21527
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  552021-03-25T04:18:10  <SuViVoR1> i am looking for it in the github repo but could'nt find it, can you please help phantomcircuit
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  572021-03-25T04:18:25  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] amitiuttarwar opened pull request #21528: [net_processing] Reduce addr blackholes  (master...2021-03-addr-defer2) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21528
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  622021-03-25T04:19:53  <SuViVoR> sorry i keep getting disconnected
  632021-03-25T04:20:09  <SuViVoR> i am looking for it in the github repo but could'nt find it, can you please help phantomcircuit
  642021-03-25T04:21:18  <SuViVoR> https://github.com/brucewayne0011/bitcoin/commit/fa30d5282cb07b6de0160d7df8b649332db97dde
  652021-03-25T04:21:24  <SuViVoR> is this the one?
  662021-03-25T04:23:06  <sipa> SuViVoR: this is good writeup: https://medium.com/@amitiu/onboarding-to-bitcoin-core-7c1a83b20365
  672021-03-25T04:23:41  <SuViVoR> thanks a lot sipa
  682021-03-25T04:24:13  <sipa> also this: https://jonatack.github.io/articles/how-to-contribute-pull-requests-to-bitcoin-core
  692021-03-25T04:24:46  <SuViVoR> thanks again :)
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  982021-03-25T07:04:13  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke pushed 2 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/8f94c70625eb...9217f9fe7351
  992021-03-25T07:04:14  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master fa818ca MarcoFalke: fuzz: [refactor] Use PickValue where possible
 1002021-03-25T07:04:14  <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 9217f9f MarcoFalke: Merge #21522: fuzz: [refactor] Use PickValue where possible
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 1032021-03-25T07:04:33  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke merged pull request #21522: fuzz: [refactor] Use PickValue where possible (master...2103-fuzzPickValue) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21522
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 1212021-03-25T10:12:32  <wumpus> hebasto: are you sure you need that and not the libxkbcommon-x11-dev package?
 1222021-03-25T10:13:07  <wumpus> (after all, the non dev packages provide runtime functionality only, i would guess the builder wants to link against it, but unsure)
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 1362021-03-25T12:13:39  <michaelfolkson> #proposedmeetingtopic Taproot activation update
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 1432021-03-25T13:04:53  <hebasto> wumpus: yes, I think, as an error is "error while loading shared libraries: libxkbcommon-x11.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory" during runtime
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 1582021-03-25T15:13:14  <shesek> why does importmulti with timestamp=now sometimes result in a (short) rescan and sometimes does not?
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 1672021-03-25T15:36:28  <darosior> shesek: iirc it always scan 2W of blocks?
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 1692021-03-25T15:39:08  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] sethupavan12 opened pull request #21529: Updated copyright year (master...patch-1) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21529
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 1752021-03-25T15:53:16  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] sethupavan12 closed pull request #21529: Updated copyright year (master...patch-1) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21529
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 1782021-03-25T15:53:37  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] sethupavan12 reopened pull request #21529: Updated copyright year (master...patch-1) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21529
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 1812021-03-25T15:53:56  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] sethupavan12 closed pull request #21529: Updated copyright year (master...patch-1) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21529
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 1872021-03-25T16:25:28  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] sethupavan12 opened pull request #21530: Updated copyright headers to 2021 (master...patch-1) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21530
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 1902021-03-25T16:34:21  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] sethupavan12 closed pull request #21530: Updated copyright headers to 2021 (master...patch-1) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21530
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 1922021-03-25T16:42:51  <wumpus> hebasto: yes that sounds like you need the runtime package; it is strange tho, that linking works apparantly but execution does not, is it different platforms maybe ? (e.g. arm versus aarch64)
 1932021-03-25T16:44:56  <hebasto> wumpus: it's linux 32bit, probably `libxkbcommon-x11-0:i386` is required
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 8542021-03-25T18:19:05  <amiti> #proposedmeetingtopic addr relay improvements
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 8702021-03-25T18:41:15  <jeremyrubin> I don't think the proposedmeetingtopic link works?
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 8732021-03-25T18:44:00  <jeremyrubin> #proposedmeetingtopic release timeline for Taproot activation and parameters
 8742021-03-25T18:44:09  <michaelfolkson> jeremyrubin: Yeah doesn't seem to be
 8752021-03-25T18:44:10  <jeremyrubin> #proposedmeetingtopic SpeedyTrial pull requests #21392 and #21377
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 8772021-03-25T18:44:13  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/21392 | Implement BIP 8 based Speedy Trial activation by achow101 · Pull Request #21392 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
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 8792021-03-25T18:44:16  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/21377 | Speedy trial support for versionbits by ajtowns · Pull Request #21377 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
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 8812021-03-25T18:45:05  <michaelfolkson> I did propose a Taproot activation topic earlier today but hasn't got picked up. Nor has amiti's
 8822021-03-25T18:45:21  <achow101> michaelfolkson: your topic is there
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 8842021-03-25T18:45:46  <achow101> I don't think it updates in real time
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 8862021-03-25T18:46:39  <michaelfolkson> Oh yeah you're right. I was looking at the wallet one
 8872021-03-25T18:46:43  * michaelfolkson slaps head
 8882021-03-25T18:47:31  <jeremyrubin> oh me too; the urls look very similar
 8892021-03-25T18:47:43  <michaelfolkson> I'm happy for you to take the Taproot topics jeremyrubin. Everyone is sick of me
 8902021-03-25T18:49:44  <phantomcircuit> jeremyrubin, freenode is also currently exploding from restarting servers
 8912021-03-25T18:50:10  <jeremyrubin> chin up michaelfolkson
 8922021-03-25T18:50:12  <wumpus> yes it can take a while for the gnusha site to update
 8932021-03-25T18:50:22  <michaelfolkson> I did try to summarize the block height versus mix of block height and MTP discussion on SE https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/103854/should-block-height-or-mtp-or-a-mixture-of-both-be-used-in-a-soft-fork-activatio
 8942021-03-25T18:50:30  <michaelfolkson> Suggested edits welcome
 8952021-03-25T18:50:36  <michaelfolkson> Ha thanks jeremyrubin
 8962021-03-25T18:51:04  <jeremyrubin> michaelfolkson: either way; I do think that more specific topics are beneficial for the core dev meeting given we're looking at a release in 1 month
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 8982021-03-25T18:55:08  <michaelfolkson> jeremyrubin: Yup specific topics better
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 9052021-03-25T19:00:44  <achow101> meeting?
 9062021-03-25T19:00:45  <wumpus> #startmeeting
 9072021-03-25T19:00:53  <jnewbery> hi
 9082021-03-25T19:00:53  <luke-jr> o hai
 9092021-03-25T19:00:56  <achow101> hi
 9102021-03-25T19:00:58  <jeremyrubin> hi
 9112021-03-25T19:00:59  <amiti> hi
 9122021-03-25T19:00:59  <wumpus> #bitcoin-core-dev Meeting: achow101 aj amiti ariard bluematt cfields Chris_Stewart_5 digi_james dongcarl elichai2 emilengler fanquake fjahr gleb glozow gmaxwell gwillen hebasto instagibbs jamesob jb55 jeremyrubin jl2012 jnewbery jonasschnelli jonatack jtimon kallewoof kanzure kvaciral lightlike luke-jr maaku marcofalke meshcollider michagogo moneyball morcos nehan NicolasDorier paveljanik
 9132021-03-25T19:01:02  <hebasto> hi
 9142021-03-25T19:01:02  <wumpus> petertodd phantomcircuit promag provoostenator ryanofsky sdaftuar sipa vasild wumpus
 9152021-03-25T19:01:13  <fjahr> hi
 9162021-03-25T19:01:17  <sipa> hi
 9172021-03-25T19:01:22  <lightlike> hi
 9182021-03-25T19:01:23  <meshcollider> hi
 9192021-03-25T19:01:23  <michaelfolkson> hi
 9202021-03-25T19:01:30  <aj_> hi
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 9222021-03-25T19:01:39  <wumpus> FYI: you can propose meeting topics with #proposedmeetingtopic during the week, they will appear in http://gnusha.org/bitcoin-core-dev/proposedmeetingtopics.txt
 9232021-03-25T19:01:49  <wumpus> These have been proposed for this week: Taproot activation update (michaelfolkson), Addr relay improvements (amiti)
 9242021-03-25T19:01:59  <ariard> hi
 9252021-03-25T19:02:15  <jeremyrubin> wumpus: I proposed 2
 9262021-03-25T19:02:20  <wumpus> any last minute topics anyone wants to discuss?
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 9282021-03-25T19:02:23  <michaelfolkson> wumpus: jeremyrubin is going to take the Taproot activation topic(s)
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 9302021-03-25T19:02:31  <michaelfolkson> wumpus: So please withdraw mine
 9312021-03-25T19:02:38  <jeremyrubin> 2021-03-25.log:11:44 < jeremyrubin> #proposedmeetingtopic release timeline for Taproot activation and parameters
 9322021-03-25T19:02:39  <jeremyrubin> 2021-03-25.log:11:44 < jeremyrubin> #proposedmeetingtopic SpeedyTrial pull requests #21392 and #21377
 9332021-03-25T19:02:42  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/21392 | Implement BIP 8 based Speedy Trial activation by achow101 · Pull Request #21392 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
 9342021-03-25T19:02:45  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/21377 | Speedy trial support for versionbits by ajtowns · Pull Request #21377 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
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 9362021-03-25T19:03:36  <wumpus> ok, yes, I was confused there because I didn't see much difference with michaelfolkson's topic, didn't notice the other one
 9372021-03-25T19:03:56  <wumpus> #topic High priority for review
 9382021-03-25T19:04:15  <wumpus> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/projects/8  has 8 blockers, 2 chasing concept ACK
 9392021-03-25T19:04:33  <wumpus> anything to add/remove or that is ready for merge?
 9402021-03-25T19:04:40  <sipa> oh short topic: how far do we want to backport BIP350/bech32m support?
 9412021-03-25T19:05:16  <wumpus> sipa: noted
 9422021-03-25T19:05:24  <ariard> #19160 is pretty mature and have been ack by jamesob, dongcarl and I, I guess it would benefit from one or two more pairs of eyes
 9432021-03-25T19:05:27  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/19160 | multiprocess: Add basic spawn and IPC support by ryanofsky · Pull Request #19160 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
 9442021-03-25T19:05:27  <sipa> dank
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 9462021-03-25T19:06:20  <wumpus> ariard: good to know, thanks
 9472021-03-25T19:06:32  <achow101> topic: windows code signing key issues
 9482021-03-25T19:06:38  <achow101> *topic suggestion
 9492021-03-25T19:06:57  <wumpus> achow101: noted
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 9522021-03-25T19:07:18  <wumpus> lots of topics today so let's move on
 9532021-03-25T19:07:21  <wumpus> #topic Addr relay improvements (amiti)
 9542021-03-25T19:07:28  <amiti> Hey all, I opened #21528 yesterday and wanted to share some thoughts around how I see it fitting in to the bigger picture.
 9552021-03-25T19:07:29  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/21528 | [net_processing] Reduce addr blackholes by amitiuttarwar · Pull Request #21528 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
 9562021-03-25T19:07:33  <amiti> The PR is currently a draft & needs some cleaning up, but serves as a proof of concept. The goal is to reduce addr blackholes- aka relaying self advertisements to peers who are unlikely to continue relaying it to the network.
 9572021-03-25T19:07:37  <amiti> The approach defers initializing the `m_addr_known` for inbound peers until they send us an addr related message. Then, it uses the presence of the filter to decide if a peer is eligible for addr relay before forwarding addresses (in `RelayAddress`).
 9582021-03-25T19:07:41  <amiti> If something like this were to land into master, it would resolve my concern with the `disabletx` proposal, and #20726 / bip 338 could focus solely on transaction handling, while not having the addr blackhole concern block the end goal of increasing block-relay-only connections.
 9592021-03-25T19:07:45  <amiti> That said, avoiding addr blackholes is a standalone win for improving addr relay, and currently would apply to block-relay-only connections as well as light clients.
 9602021-03-25T19:07:50  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/20726 | p2p: Add DISABLETX message for negotiating block-relay-only connections by sdaftuar · Pull Request #20726 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
 9612021-03-25T19:07:50  <amiti> Also want to mention, I do think this patch would be simpler / safer on top of the net/net_processing addr refactoring that jnewbery is doing. So if anyone is interested in helping, you can review this PR or #21236.
 9622021-03-25T19:07:53  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/21236 | Net processing: Extract `addr` send functionality into MaybeSendAddr() by jnewbery · Pull Request #21236 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
 9632021-03-25T19:07:57  <amiti> That’s all! Let me know if you have any questions or feedback :)
 9642021-03-25T19:07:59  * michaelfolkson needs time to read
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 9662021-03-25T19:08:27  <sipa> amiti: is there are risk of having both sides "wait" until they see an addr?
 9672021-03-25T19:08:37  <luke-jr> amiti types fast :P
 9682021-03-25T19:08:55  <amiti> def a risk, but shouldn't be a problem in the implementation
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 9702021-03-25T19:09:09  <amiti> also there's asymmetry, we setup addr relay for outbound connections
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 9722021-03-25T19:10:05  <jnewbery> in the current implementation, we'll always send our initial self-advertisement to outbounds
 9732021-03-25T19:10:21  <amiti> (other than block-relay-only)
 9742021-03-25T19:10:43  <sipa> not sure how i feel about making the assumption that a peer who doesn't relay addresses to us would be necessarily uninterested in getting them
 9752021-03-25T19:11:05  <jnewbery> if they want them, they can send a getaddr
 9762021-03-25T19:11:05  <lightlike> some peers might be blackholes by not actively sending addrs further, but they will still require addrs. should they use getaddr for that only?
 9772021-03-25T19:11:17  <sipa> jnewbery: ah, that's a good point
 9782021-03-25T19:11:22  <aj> sipa: we send GETADDR to our outbounds always, and consider inbounds non-blackholes if we receive GETADDR
 9792021-03-25T19:11:36  <jnewbery> i think it'd be strange if a node wanted addrs but didn't send a getaddr
 9802021-03-25T19:11:41  <sipa> that's fair
 9812021-03-25T19:11:53  <ariard> i need to think about how it might affect lightclients, not sure if they do addr-relay with any consistency
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 9832021-03-25T19:12:24  <wumpus> light clients never do addr relay afaik
 9842021-03-25T19:12:26  <amiti> lightlike: yeah, I don't think we can prevent  all situations of blackholing, but the patch should mitigate some normal usage patterns
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 9862021-03-25T19:12:46  <sipa> if we're going to give addresses to a peer, we must assume they can relay them further
 9872021-03-25T19:12:47  <luke-jr> wumpus: but ideally they would
 9882021-03-25T19:12:51  <jeremyrubin> so to summarize; it's basically don't send addrs till they've been requested once?
 9892021-03-25T19:12:54  <luke-jr> or at least keep an addr db
 9902021-03-25T19:13:00  <ariard> wumpus: that's my memory too but ideally they should
 9912021-03-25T19:13:23  <amiti> jeremyrubin: yes but with the added clause of to inbound peers
 9922021-03-25T19:13:47  <sipa> you can't have a mode where you consider a peer both a blackhole, but still give them addresses... because such a state could be abused to bias addr relay
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 9952021-03-25T19:14:25  <jnewbery> jeremyrubin: or if that peer has relayed an addr to us
 9962021-03-25T19:14:29  <sipa> so i think it's correct to only use as criterion does this peer _want_ addresses or not; not whether they're going to relay it further
 9972021-03-25T19:14:40  <jeremyrubin> sipa: +1
 9982021-03-25T19:15:21  <jeremyrubin> How much bandwidth does this save amiti?
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10002021-03-25T19:15:35  <jamesob> hi, sorry am late
10012021-03-25T19:16:07  <sipa> jeremyrubin: i think it's mostly an attempt at avoiding black holing?
10022021-03-25T19:16:08  <amiti> jeremyrubin: hm, I don't know. the motivation was more about addr relay than bandwidth.
10032021-03-25T19:16:36  <jeremyrubin> I'm just trying to grok why we care
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10052021-03-25T19:16:44  <jeremyrubin> if it can't stop a malicious peer from becoming a black hole
10062021-03-25T19:16:54  <amiti> its for reducing the total black holes
10072021-03-25T19:16:57  <jeremyrubin> why do we care if a honest peer is a black hole?
10082021-03-25T19:17:07  *** sipsorcery <sipsorcery!~sipsorcer@2a02:8084:6981:7880::3> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
10092021-03-25T19:17:13  <jeremyrubin> so we don't advertise them or something?
10102021-03-25T19:17:23  <jnewbery> jeremyrubin: not much bandwidth. At most we only send one addr message per peer every 30 seconds
10112021-03-25T19:17:27  <sipa> jeremyrubin: because in general you assume the network has some minimal number of honest peers
10122021-03-25T19:17:42  <amiti> so, a key component of addr relay is self advertisement. approximately once a day we announce our addr to each peer, and when we receive those messages from others, we relay to 1-2 peers
10132021-03-25T19:17:47  <aj> jeremyrubin: we only choose a few peers to relay to every day via RelayAddress() don't want to pick ones that don't care about addresses
10142021-03-25T19:17:49  <sipa> this doesn't have any effect if all your peers are intentionally-blackholing attackers
10152021-03-25T19:17:54  <amiti> the idea is an ongoing trickle of announcing addrs
10162021-03-25T19:18:12  <jeremyrubin> Ok I'm just trying to understand why we care about blackholes, which the PR could better motivate
10172021-03-25T19:18:21  <jeremyrubin> I can take it out of band from the meeting though
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10192021-03-25T19:18:47  *** Talkless <Talkless!~Talkless@mail.dargis.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
10202021-03-25T19:19:09  <amiti> jeremyrubin: has your question been answered here?
10212021-03-25T19:19:20  <sipa> seems like a reasonable idea; maybe we can also discuss it further in a P2P meeting
10222021-03-25T19:19:27  <jnewbery> sipa: right, this isn't effective against peers 'maliciously' not relaying your addrs, but I don't think anything can be, except a diversity of peers.
10232021-03-25T19:19:36  <sipa> jnewbery: indeed
10242021-03-25T19:19:45  *** jonatack_ <jonatack_!~jon@> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
10252021-03-25T19:19:46  <jeremyrubin> amiti: no; it's OK though. I just don't see which resource this is saving us
10262021-03-25T19:20:01  <jnewbery> jeremyrubin: it's not saving a resource
10272021-03-25T19:20:06  <amiti> its less about resource saving and more about addr propagation
10282021-03-25T19:20:08  <aj> jeremyrubin: see net_processing::RelayAddress
10292021-03-25T19:20:10  <sipa> jnewbery: it more a "you *definitely* don't care about addresses? ok, then i'll send them to someone else instead"
10302021-03-25T19:20:18  <jnewbery> sipa: exactly
10312021-03-25T19:20:20  <amiti> sipa: exactly
10322021-03-25T19:20:21  <amiti> :)
10332021-03-25T19:20:47  <wumpus> time for next topic?
10342021-03-25T19:20:53  <wumpus> #topic Release timeline for Taproot activation and parameters (jeremyrubin)
10352021-03-25T19:20:54  <amiti> yeah sounds good
10362021-03-25T19:20:58  <amiti> thanks for the input!
10372021-03-25T19:21:25  <jeremyrubin> ok, so we had a meeting on tuesday in ##taproot-activation
10382021-03-25T19:21:33  <jeremyrubin> I posted notes to bitcoin-dev mailing list
10392021-03-25T19:21:34  *** sipsorcery <sipsorcery!~sipsorcer@2a02:8084:6981:7880::3> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)
10402021-03-25T19:21:39  <sipa> amiti: i feel a comic coming up? :)
10412021-03-25T19:22:04  *** sipsorcery <sipsorcery!~sipsorcer@2a02:8084:6981:7880::3> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
10422021-03-25T19:22:14  <jeremyrubin> The outcome of that is that we're looking at a release with parameters in the next month, assuming there's not strong opposition for whatever reason
10432021-03-25T19:22:18  <amiti> sipa: suggestions always welcome :)
10442021-03-25T19:22:43  <achow101> didn't we have this discussion last week?
10452021-03-25T19:22:49  <jeremyrubin> With respect to ST, we agreed that we should fix for a Novemeber 15th height regardless of release date/starttime
10462021-03-25T19:23:12  <michaelfolkson> achow101: Updates, progress since last week
10472021-03-25T19:23:13  <jeremyrubin> achow101: it didn't have sufficient heads up that a meeting was happening for it to be a respectful process
10482021-03-25T19:23:51  <sipa> i'm planning to through all the activation related PRs for code review; new comments on what activation is actually appropriate
10492021-03-25T19:23:51  <sipa> s/new/no/
10502021-03-25T19:24:08  <michaelfolkson> +1 for a black hole amiti comic
10512021-03-25T19:24:23  <michaelfolkson> Full nodes in outer space
10522021-03-25T19:24:49  <jeremyrubin> can we keep it on topic?
10532021-03-25T19:25:07  <jeremyrubin> Does anyone have any reservations with a release during April?
10542021-03-25T19:25:19  <wumpus> summary from last week was: wumpus  so summary re: taproot activation: aim for april 3 for 0.21.1rc1, review both PRs asap, please hold up merging conflicting PRs for now
10552021-03-25T19:25:28  <wumpus> michaelfolkson: yessss
10562021-03-25T19:25:37  <achow101> I think we can keep the timeline that we discussed last week
10572021-03-25T19:25:43  <aj> are we aiming for taproot activation params in rc2 not rc1 then?
10582021-03-25T19:25:59  <wumpus> aj: w-why
10592021-03-25T19:26:03  <achow101> aj: rc1, but have space for an rc2 for other issues that may crop up
10602021-03-25T19:26:05  <luke-jr> aj: no? rc1 should be a cnadidate..
10612021-03-25T19:26:13  <wumpus> the aim should always be to get things into the first possible rc
10622021-03-25T19:26:21  <aj> okay
10632021-03-25T19:26:34  <aj> april 3 sounds very quick!
10642021-03-25T19:26:37  <wumpus> planning for something to do in rc2 sounds really strange to me but dunno
10652021-03-25T19:26:42  <jeremyrubin> Ok, wumpus does it seem that we can get rc1 by then?
10662021-03-25T19:26:48  <wumpus> aj: yes it might be too soon
10672021-03-25T19:26:52  <wumpus> jeremyrubin: to be honest? no
10682021-03-25T19:27:22  <michaelfolkson> Are there any follow up PRs planned for either achow101 PR or aj PR? I think achow101 has said he plans at least one follow up. I think all of aj fuzzing PRs are merged?
10692021-03-25T19:27:27  <luke-jr> jeremyrubin: aim for it, so the inevitable slip is a slip :P
10702021-03-25T19:27:29  <wumpus> if you mean "can you go through the release process by then" sure, but it seems somewhat rushed, did we decide which of the two PRs to choose yet?
10712021-03-25T19:27:46  <aj> wumpus: "by then" == "may 1st" ?
10722021-03-25T19:27:52  <achow101> michaelfolkson: only followup is the activation parameters. other followups don't need backport
10732021-03-25T19:28:03  <michaelfolkson> achow101: Ok cool
10742021-03-25T19:28:15  <jeremyrubin> There's some question of which of the PRs. hence sep topic
10752021-03-25T19:28:19  <achow101> actually april 10th for rc1 still keeps the timeline.
10762021-03-25T19:28:27  <wumpus> aj: people are talking about *april 3*
10772021-03-25T19:28:58  <jeremyrubin> w.r.t. the mid-MTP thing, the starttime is less sensitive than the stoptime
10782021-03-25T19:29:02  <michaelfolkson> I tried writing up the block height versus mix of block height and MTP discussion on a SE question. Suggested edits welcome https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/103854/should-block-height-or-mtp-or-a-mixture-of-both-be-used-in-a-soft-fork-activatio
10792021-03-25T19:29:18  <aj> wumpus: i think jeremyrubin's/##t-a's last timeline was rc1 out the door by may 1st?
10802021-03-25T19:29:20  <jeremyrubin> so I don't think we need to worry that much about releasing with whatever start we want
10812021-03-25T19:29:21  <wumpus> achow101: bumping it to april 10 does sound a bit more realistic
10822021-03-25T19:29:33  <luke-jr> MTP was never a viable option to begin with
10832021-03-25T19:29:46  <BlueMatt> wumpus: in the meeting there was also discussion of "it takes the time it takes, if it slips, ok, if it slips past mid-may, then we bump the eventual lock-in time, if it doesnt, then we always set activation to estimated-release + 1 week or so"
10842021-03-25T19:29:51  <jeremyrubin> My suggestion was rc1 may 1st, starttime may 7th, 1st period signalling mid may
10852021-03-25T19:29:54  <wumpus> aj: I was pasting from the conclusion of last week's IRC meeting, I do not know what was discussed elsewhere
10862021-03-25T19:29:59  <michaelfolkson> Currently achow101 PR is entirely block height and aj PR is a mix of block height and MTP
10872021-03-25T19:30:01  <aj> wumpus: aha, thanks
10882021-03-25T19:30:04  *** valwal <valwal!~valwal@pool-96-239-17-242.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
10892021-03-25T19:30:04  *** smctwo <smctwo!~smctwo@> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
10902021-03-25T19:30:10  <BlueMatt> so the timeline can and shoulld de dependent on when the release finishes, its not a "we have to get release by X"
10912021-03-25T19:30:24  <BlueMatt> at least in the taproot-activation discussion
10922021-03-25T19:30:34  <jeremyrubin> BlueMatt: sure, but we should set a schedule we're trying to keep
10932021-03-25T19:30:40  <achow101> BlueMatt: yes, but also, deadlines are a motivator, even if they are fuzzy
10942021-03-25T19:30:41  <wumpus> BlueMatt: that's the only thing that makes sense anyway
10952021-03-25T19:30:42  <jeremyrubin> april 3 seems unrealistic
10962021-03-25T19:30:51  <sipa> doesn't the start date needs wider coordination? like talking to miners and businesses to see if they're ready to deploy?
10972021-03-25T19:30:59  <BlueMatt> if we dont know when the code gets merged, then we cant pick a day, until then, the schedule is merge + whatever.
10982021-03-25T19:31:03  <luke-jr> sipa: if they aren't, they just don't signal
10992021-03-25T19:31:07  <wumpus> 'do a release at all costs' is a big nope to me
11002021-03-25T19:31:12  <jeremyrubin> sipa: No; start date is not super sensitive IMO compared to stop date
11012021-03-25T19:31:23  <luke-jr> sipa: but yes, wider coordination on startheight is important anyway
11022021-03-25T19:31:25  <sipa> okay, not going to wade into that
11032021-03-25T19:31:25  <BlueMatt> s/stop/activation/
11042021-03-25T19:31:32  *** smctwo <smctwo!~smctwo@> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)
11052021-03-25T19:31:41  <jeremyrubin> activation is sensitive OTOH
11062021-03-25T19:31:53  <jeremyrubin> the outcome of that was we'll project out a height for November 15th
11072021-03-25T19:31:57  <michaelfolkson> It would be nice to announce a start height as early as we can
11082021-03-25T19:32:08  *** smctwo <smctwo!~smctwo@bba601296.alshamil.net.ae> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
11092021-03-25T19:32:08  <michaelfolkson> But not at expense of rushing
11102021-03-25T19:32:14  <jeremyrubin> michaelfolkson: doesn't matter till it's in a release
11112021-03-25T19:32:36  <BlueMatt> anyway, not sure there's more discussion to be had here - the code can be merged when its ready, until then, its just speculation
11122021-03-25T19:32:38  <wumpus> was one PR chosen? is it clsoe to merge?
11132021-03-25T19:32:43  <jeremyrubin> next topic?
11142021-03-25T19:32:45  <BlueMatt> review the code, decide on the pr, and then talk again
11152021-03-25T19:32:53  <BlueMatt> wumpus: nope, thats up to code review, mostly.
11162021-03-25T19:32:58  <jeremyrubin> wumpus: (as in, next topic is about that)
11172021-03-25T19:33:02  <BlueMatt> because, ultimately, no one could decide.
11182021-03-25T19:33:05  <wumpus> we didn't even decide a PR yet? yes, I think this is pointless like this, let's move on
11192021-03-25T19:33:08  <sipa> BlueMatt: nack
11202021-03-25T19:33:14  <luke-jr> wumpus: yes, achow101's
11212021-03-25T19:33:20  <achow101> both PRs are at one ack
11222021-03-25T19:33:20  <wumpus> #topic How far do we want to backport BIP350/bech32m support? (sipa)
11232021-03-25T19:33:23  <BlueMatt> sipa: to...?
11242021-03-25T19:33:36  <sipa> i *really* dislike using "this things seems to get reviewed faster" as a criterion to decide how consensus changes will be activated
11252021-03-25T19:33:45  <luke-jr> sipa: not sure why BIP350 would be eligible for backporting at all
11262021-03-25T19:33:56  <sipa> there should be a clear proposal, with buy-in, and then we implement that
11272021-03-25T19:34:13  <BlueMatt> sipa: nooooo, thats not what I was suggesting, I was suggesting a part of the criteria is what code reviewers think of it
11282021-03-25T19:34:29  <sipa> BlueMatt: hmm ok
11292021-03-25T19:34:30  <wumpus> sipa: right, I don't think it's great to have two competing PRs for this at all, I think it would make sense to choose one and close the other kind of asap
11302021-03-25T19:34:35  <michaelfolkson> If you'd prefer entirely block height then you'd prefer achow101 PR. Please read my SE link on that
11312021-03-25T19:34:38  <BlueMatt> as in, which one happens is basically "people are kinda fine with whatever, but if code reviewers feel strongly about one vs the other's safety in code, then we go with that"
11322021-03-25T19:34:50  <sipa> i'm happy to do code review for all of them
11332021-03-25T19:34:59  <achow101> luke-jr: presumably to allow sending to taproot without upgrading major release?
11342021-03-25T19:34:59  <luke-jr> ST (with heights) has wide support; this MTP variant does not.
11352021-03-25T19:35:00  <wumpus> it really doesn't make sense to discuss a timeline every week if there is no progress in that regard
11362021-03-25T19:35:03  <sipa> but i'm not going to ack merging until it's clear which one is chosen
11372021-03-25T19:35:04  <ariard> i've reviewed both,  i've a preference for bip9-amendment, would review both anyway
11382021-03-25T19:35:07  <michaelfolkson> I personally have a preference for a consistent use of block height across the activation mechanims
11392021-03-25T19:35:17  <ariard> but better to focus on one
11402021-03-25T19:35:30  <michaelfolkson> Mixing block height and MTP doesn't make sense to me
11412021-03-25T19:35:52  <michaelfolkson> But as I said please read my SE post and suggest edits and improvements
11422021-03-25T19:36:03  <BlueMatt> sipa: ultimately, there's....rather strong personalities who are stuck in the sand on picking one, but a small enough set of people and an equal amount on both sides, so deciding is gonna require code review deciding on code safety :/
11432021-03-25T19:36:40  <sipa> sigh
11442021-03-25T19:36:41  <jeremyrubin> wumpus: I agree, but then the most likely outcome is a UASF BIP lOT=true released before we agree on anything, which is precisely what certain people have NACKd
11452021-03-25T19:36:53  <jeremyrubin> so it seems deleterious to not just decide on one or the other
11462021-03-25T19:37:03  <michaelfolkson> I think reviewers can come to a view on block height versus a mix of block height and MTP perrsonally
11472021-03-25T19:37:21  <jeremyrubin> Either can be compatible with a subsequent BIP8 release
11482021-03-25T19:37:25  <michaelfolkson> jeremyrubin: Any UASF is entirely irrelevant to this discussion
11492021-03-25T19:37:27  <sipa> i don't care about one or the other; i think all of this is a storm in a cup of water
11502021-03-25T19:37:32  <sipa> just pick one ffs
11512021-03-25T19:37:36  <BlueMatt> michaelfolkson: jeremyrubin please take it to taproot-activation.
11522021-03-25T19:37:39  <ariard> sipa: thanks!
11532021-03-25T19:37:55  <wumpus> if we want to get to to all the topics today, we should move on
11542021-03-25T19:38:10  <BlueMatt> sipa: well, the people who show up in taproot-activation are....the people who feel the strongest and the most stubborn about it. without more voices there, there will be no agreement, sadly.
11552021-03-25T19:38:11  <ariard> we should do a fair coins toss fwiw
11562021-03-25T19:38:21  <BlueMatt> anyway, lets move on, this isnt the right venue to debate it.
11572021-03-25T19:38:32  <wumpus> we can also discuss taproot for the rest of the meeting, of course
11582021-03-25T19:38:55  <luke-jr> thought we were trying to give sipa the floor for BIP350
11592021-03-25T19:38:57  <wumpus> ~20 mins to go
11602021-03-25T19:38:57  <achow101> re the actual topic: I think it makes sense to backport to 0.21 and 0.20
11612021-03-25T19:39:03  <wumpus> sipa: your topic pls
11622021-03-25T19:39:08  <sipa> hji!
11632021-03-25T19:39:19  <sipa> so we merged #20861
11642021-03-25T19:39:22  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/20861 | BIP 350: Implement Bech32m and use it for v1+ segwit addresses by sipa · Pull Request #20861 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
11652021-03-25T19:39:26  <wumpus> yes
11662021-03-25T19:39:30  <sipa> which adds send-to-bech32m support and related tests
11672021-03-25T19:39:51  <sipa> amending what address checksum is expected for v1+ native segwit addresses
11682021-03-25T19:40:06  <sipa> i think this is something that should be backported... it may not matter, depending on activation of course
11692021-03-25T19:40:13  <jeremyrubin> sipa: maybe backport anywhere taproot is getting backported + 1 version?
11702021-03-25T19:40:23  <wumpus> let's do that then
11712021-03-25T19:40:24  <jnewbery> I don't think #21472 is required. 0.19 is out of maintenance, and this isn't a critical fix. It'll be EOL in August: https://bitcoincore.org/en/lifecycle/#schedule
11722021-03-25T19:40:25  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/21472 | BIP 350: Implement Bech32m and use it for v1+ segwit addresses (0.19 backport) by sipa · Pull Request #21472 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
11732021-03-25T19:40:35  <jeremyrubin> I agree you should be able to pay addresses you see, even if you don't know how to create such an address
11742021-03-25T19:40:56  <sipa> but it would be unfortunate if adoption (once activated etc) is hampered by the fact that you can't send to it from stable bitcoin core releases
11752021-03-25T19:41:02  <sipa> i'm ok with 0.21 and 0.20
11762021-03-25T19:41:02  <luke-jr> 0.20 will be end-maint in Aug too
11772021-03-25T19:41:10  <wumpus> well if he already made a PR for it, then I don't see why not to backport
11782021-03-25T19:41:25  <sipa> also ok with just 0.21, if that's what we decide
11792021-03-25T19:41:27  <wumpus> *if* we are going to do another 0.19 release is another question of course
11802021-03-25T19:41:43  <jnewbery> I've reviewed 0.20 and 0.21. Both look good to me.
11812021-03-25T19:41:45  <sipa> i just opened backports as far back as they were nontrivial
11822021-03-25T19:42:01  <luke-jr> seems better to just limit to 0.21
11832021-03-25T19:42:14  <luke-jr> I don't think anyone plans to backport Taproot itself to 0.20?
11842021-03-25T19:42:34  <luke-jr> consensus code I mean
11852021-03-25T19:42:38  <achow101> luke-jr: you don't need taproot in order to make taproot outputs
11862021-03-25T19:42:40  <wumpus> luke-jr: that doesn't matter here, it's for sending to it
11872021-03-25T19:42:49  <wumpus> might backport one release further for that
11882021-03-25T19:43:00  <jeremyrubin> sipa: one question; if taproot doesn't activate can you still send to these addresses?
11892021-03-25T19:43:15  <luke-jr> achow101: but if you're doing economic stuff, you should be using a full node
11902021-03-25T19:43:17  <jeremyrubin> Might be kinda weird if you can pay to them before they activate
11912021-03-25T19:43:44  <jeremyrubin> (that's true for next-release as well as backport)
11922021-03-25T19:43:46  <sipa> jeremyrubin: being able to send to future addresses is pretty essential for smooth upgrading
11932021-03-25T19:44:13  <jeremyrubin> sipa: you could only enable sending to them from wallet iff it activates and height > minactiveheight
11942021-03-25T19:44:18  <wumpus> that would be weird but also, why would anyone do that
11952021-03-25T19:44:38  <jeremyrubin> not sure, many ways to lose money I spose
11962021-03-25T19:44:39  <aj> jeremyrubin: been able to send to them since 0.19 due to #15846
11972021-03-25T19:44:41  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/15846 | [POLICY] Make sending to future native witness outputs standard by sipa · Pull Request #15846 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
11982021-03-25T19:44:46  <achow101> jeremyrubin: that removes the upgrade advantage
11992021-03-25T19:44:46  <wumpus> it doesn't seem like something you can do by accident and there are tons of ways to lose coins if you really want
12002021-03-25T19:44:51  <jeremyrubin> aj: ack
12012021-03-25T19:44:54  <achow101> it's up to the receiver to decide whether he wants to lose money
12022021-03-25T19:45:28  <wumpus> so ok: 0.20 and 0.21?
12032021-03-25T19:45:31  <sipa> jeremyrubin: also #20165
12042021-03-25T19:45:33  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/20165 | Only relay Taproot spends if next block has it active by sipa · Pull Request #20165 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
12052021-03-25T19:45:37  <achow101> wumpus: ack
12062021-03-25T19:45:45  <sipa> jeremyrubin: but that's about *spending*, not sending to
12072021-03-25T19:45:56  <jeremyrubin> hmm
12082021-03-25T19:46:07  <wumpus> I think we need to move to next topic
12092021-03-25T19:46:19  <wumpus> #topic SpeedyTrial pull requests (jeremyrubin)
12102021-03-25T19:46:25  <luke-jr> O.o
12112021-03-25T19:46:45  <jeremyrubin> There are two open PRs
12122021-03-25T19:46:49  <wumpus> yes
12132021-03-25T19:46:57  <wumpus> didn't we go through this already
12142021-03-25T19:46:58  <jeremyrubin> there is not community consensus on either one
12152021-03-25T19:47:08  <jeremyrubin> IDK it's the topic again so I thought I'd summarize
12162021-03-25T19:47:20  <wumpus> well you proposed two topics I don't know why
12172021-03-25T19:47:27  <wumpus> if it's unnecessary let's move on
12182021-03-25T19:47:32  <BlueMatt> i think we covered this pretty fully
12192021-03-25T19:47:35  <michaelfolkson> I agree we need to break the deadlock on the two PRs asap. Spreading review effort over two PRs at this stage is not optimal
12202021-03-25T19:47:51  <sipa> michaelfolkson: and we're not going to do that here
12212021-03-25T19:47:53  <wumpus> #topic Windows code signing issues (achow101)
12222021-03-25T19:48:30  <achow101> The windows code signing key expired yesterday. I've been trying to renew it, but somehow in that process, comodo revoked the key. This is causing users who install 0.20 or 0.21 on windows to be unable to run the installer
12232021-03-25T19:48:53  <wumpus> uh oh
12242021-03-25T19:49:04  <aj> yikes
12252021-03-25T19:49:07  <wumpus> do you know why they revoked the key?
12262021-03-25T19:49:08  *** bitcoin-git <bitcoin-git!~bitcoin-g@x0f.org> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
12272021-03-25T19:49:08  <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] sipa closed pull request #21472: BIP 350: Implement Bech32m and use it for v1+ segwit addresses (0.19 backport) (0.19...202103_bech32m_0.19) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21472
12282021-03-25T19:49:09  *** bitcoin-git <bitcoin-git!~bitcoin-g@x0f.org> has left #bitcoin-core-dev
12292021-03-25T19:49:11  <achow101> comodo has also changed how they are verifying the Bitcoin Core Code Signing Association which is making it harder to get the renewed key. jonasschnelli_ is working on that, but it could be a while
12302021-03-25T19:49:22  <achow101> so it is possible that for the next release, we may not have a windows code signing key
12312021-03-25T19:49:33  <achow101> and also we probably need to re-sign 0.20 and 0.21
12322021-03-25T19:49:43  <wumpus> yes
12332021-03-25T19:49:45  <achow101> I have no idea why the key was revoked
12342021-03-25T19:50:01  <achow101> I emailed support and they haven't responded :/
12352021-03-25T19:50:10  <wumpus> is it possible to install on windows without a signing key?
12362021-03-25T19:50:16  <achow101> yes
12372021-03-25T19:50:21  <achow101> there is a non-codesigned installer
12382021-03-25T19:50:37  <luke-jr> but the codesigned one is a no-go?
12392021-03-25T19:50:42  <wumpus> can we get a key from a different provider if comodo becomes difficult?
12402021-03-25T19:51:09  <achow101> luke-jr: pretty much. this is what people see: https://github.com/bitcoin-core/gui/issues/252
12412021-03-25T19:51:45  <wumpus> should I delete the codesigned one from the website? (or move it out of the way at least)
12422021-03-25T19:51:46  <achow101> wumpus: yes, but they are way more expensive ($3-400 vs $80 per yr) and probably have similar organization verification requirements
12432021-03-25T19:52:21  <wumpus> if it is no longer usable it makes no sense to host it, after all
12442021-03-25T19:52:32  <achow101> sure
12452021-03-25T19:52:43  <sipa> right
12462021-03-25T19:52:46  <jeremyrubin> achow101: does the non codesigned one make it harder to install
12472021-03-25T19:52:49  <sipa> perhaps move it to an archive section or so
12482021-03-25T19:52:58  <achow101> we have bitcoin-0.21.0-win64-setup-unsigned.exe from the gitian builds which is non-codesigned that we can upload
12492021-03-25T19:53:06  <luke-jr> good question - why are we even signing it on Windows? XD
12502021-03-25T19:53:11  <wumpus> sipa: yeah
12512021-03-25T19:53:16  <achow101> jeremyrubin: it gives a warning iirc
12522021-03-25T19:53:24  <achow101> but the warning can be ignored
12532021-03-25T19:53:36  <luke-jr> achow101: doesn't _any_ download?
12542021-03-25T19:53:39  <wumpus> the only annoyance is that I need to regenrate the SHA256SUMS.asc, and ideally the torrent too
12552021-03-25T19:53:46  <wumpus> oh can it be ignored?
12562021-03-25T19:53:48  <luke-jr> only difference IIRC was that signed just shows an author name
12572021-03-25T19:53:57  <emzy> does it make sense to have 2 signing certs just in case for problems like this?
12582021-03-25T19:54:07  <achow101> luke-jr: it says something about "untrusted" if it isn't code signed. I think that's just about it
12592021-03-25T19:54:10  <luke-jr> wumpus: maybe wait on the torrent until we have a full resolution?
12602021-03-25T19:54:24  *** jonatack__ <jonatack__!~jon@> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
12612021-03-25T19:54:33  <luke-jr> emzy: doubt you can sign it twice
12622021-03-25T19:54:50  <jeremyrubin> FWIW; I don't think it makes sense to hold out on any releases that are ready to go based on this issue
12632021-03-25T19:54:56  <wumpus> the process is kind of a hassle so I'm not going to do this for all releases, but for the last 0.20.x and 0.21.x release sure
12642021-03-25T19:55:09  <sipa> jeremyrubin: agree, but we should also try to fix it going forward
12652021-03-25T19:55:24  <jamesob> (aside) maybe at some point we can stop doing Windows releases altogether and just recommend people run them through the graphical WSL subsystem (https://www.zdnet.com/article/linux-graphical-apps-coming-to-windows-subsystem-for-linux/)
12662021-03-25T19:55:26  <wumpus> jeremyrubin: no one is speaking of holding up anything, and I agree
12672021-03-25T19:55:36  <jeremyrubin> last week it was :p
12682021-03-25T19:55:37  <luke-jr> jamesob: lol
12692021-03-25T19:56:04  <wumpus> jamesob: that's a completely different discusion (though a potentially interesting one but there is no time for that now :)
12702021-03-25T19:56:18  <achow101> I'll get a screenshot of the three different warnings and put them in the earlier issue
12712021-03-25T19:56:24  <jamesob> wumpus: yeah sorry for lobbing that grenade
12722021-03-25T19:56:35  <emzy> luke-jr: have a second backup cert for a second binary. That was my thinking, but it will double the work :(
12732021-03-25T19:56:36  <wumpus> in any case we need a windows installer that works that people can download
12742021-03-25T19:56:44  <luke-jr> jamesob: looks like it's Wayland - do we even support that?
12752021-03-25T19:56:52  <achow101> wumpus: the unsigned one is fine for that
12762021-03-25T19:56:56  <wumpus> luke-jr: no, the binary does not support wayland
12772021-03-25T19:57:05  <wumpus> luke-jr: self-built ones do
12782021-03-25T19:57:30  <wumpus> see #19950 wrt wayland
12792021-03-25T19:57:31  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/19950 | [Linux] Add wayland support · Issue #19950 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
12802021-03-25T19:57:38  <luke-jr> "it connects the graphical Linux applications via a Remote Desktop Protocol (RDP) connection to the main Windows display"
12812021-03-25T19:57:42  <luke-jr> sounds ugly for end users
12822021-03-25T19:57:50  <wumpus> luke-jr: anyhow this is off topic now
12832021-03-25T19:57:54  <wumpus> achow101: ok
12842021-03-25T19:57:54  <luke-jr> sorry
12852021-03-25T19:58:01  <aj> was this the last topic?
12862021-03-25T19:58:11  *** jonatack_ <jonatack_!~jon@> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
12872021-03-25T19:58:21  *** BlueMatt <BlueMatt!~BlueMatt@unaffiliated/bluematt> has left #bitcoin-core-dev ("-> meetup. those with less strong views but views nonetheless should join taproot-activation meetings!")
12882021-03-25T19:58:30  <wumpus> aj: I think so! I didn't expect to get this far but hadn't noticed the speedytrial one was more or less duplicate
12892021-03-25T19:58:46  <aj> wumpus: great success!
12902021-03-25T19:58:48  <wumpus> #endmeeting
12912021-03-25T19:58:49  <jnewbery> speedymeeting
12922021-03-25T19:59:07  <jnewbery> thanks wumpus!
12932021-03-25T20:00:34  <jeremyrubin> it wasn't intended to be duplicate -- it does really help to break topics into smaller chunks so that you can build consensus on one part of the puzzle without needing the other
12942021-03-25T20:01:33  <sipa> jeremyrubin: fwiw, the reason why sending to future addresses needs to be supported (at least as a relay policy) is that otherwise you force wallets to keep up with it (e.g. say some service supports withdrawals, and does batching, ... one customer gives a future address and another gives a current address... batching them together both payments get stuck)
12952021-03-25T20:01:42  <dongcarl> achow101: Is https://github.com/bitcoin-core/gui/issues/252 where I should follow the codesigning discussions?
12962021-03-25T20:02:31  <jeremyrubin> sipa: yeah, noted. I think it's good as long as no one puts tools out to *generate* taproot addresses ahead of activation
12972021-03-25T20:03:00  <sipa> jeremyrubin: this i think was a snafu with bech32 that resulted in it actually failing (basically nobody supported sending to future addresses, because they *had* to: relay policy didn't allow it either)
12982021-03-25T20:03:02  <jeremyrubin> I could see there being confusion with "Taproot is locked in" and "Taproot is active"
12992021-03-25T20:03:19  <achow101> dongcarl: yes
13002021-03-25T20:03:43  <jeremyrubin> sipa: yeah I think in general you send to a bad address you pay the price is the best we can do
13012021-03-25T20:04:15  <sipa> but i think the combination of support relay of sending to: always; support relay of spending: only when rules are active
13022021-03-25T20:04:18  <sipa> is ideal
13032021-03-25T20:05:04  <jeremyrubin> yeah I agree because you can be tricked into relaying bad txs after activation
13042021-03-25T20:05:22  <jeremyrubin> so it makes sense to only relay spends you suspect you can fully validate
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13062021-03-25T20:06:51  <wumpus> jnewbery: yw!
13072021-03-25T20:07:28  <jeremyrubin> yw?
13082021-03-25T20:07:30  <wumpus> jeremyrubin: yes i understand your motivation for splitting it up, it just came as a bit of a shock just after the monster topic was concluded to see it come up again :)
13092021-03-25T20:08:02  <wumpus> in any case, let's not make it a meeting topiuc again until at least the PR has been decided
13102021-03-25T20:08:02  <jeremyrubin> wumpus: probably could have gone in reverse order
13112021-03-25T20:08:41  <jeremyrubin> I was hoping that in the meeting, w.r.t. PRs, we could have discussed the practicality of reviewing/merging/backporting either
13122021-03-25T20:08:51  <jeremyrubin> And if it fits in with the timeline being desired
13132021-03-25T20:08:59  <wumpus> I think we need to do that after a PR has been decided
13142021-03-25T20:09:19  *** jonatack__ <jonatack__!~jon@> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
13152021-03-25T20:09:20  <wumpus> with such a tight schedule it is a really bad idea to spread the time and resources over two PRs here
13162021-03-25T20:09:36  <jeremyrubin> wumpus: I think the issue is that "people" have decided on a tight schedule
13172021-03-25T20:09:46  <jeremyrubin> that's my only preference for AJ's PR
13182021-03-25T20:09:55  <jeremyrubin> is if we are trying to meet that timeline or not
13192021-03-25T20:10:33  <aj> jeremyrubin: fwiw, 21377 cleanly backports currently
13202021-03-25T20:11:01  <jeremyrubin> aj: yep
13212021-03-25T20:11:04  <aj> jeremyrubin: (modulo 21489, which also cleanly backports)
13222021-03-25T20:12:30  <achow101> screenshots of the different prompts that appear for the windows installers: https://github.com/bitcoin-core/gui/issues/252#issuecomment-807400048 The non-codesigned warning has gotten scarier.
13232021-03-25T20:12:42  <aj> should i manually add 21489 (which i labelled as needs-backport-0.21 already) to the 0.21 milestone? or just open a pr backporting it? or?
13242021-03-25T20:12:51  <aj> (it's needed whichever pr gets merged)
13252021-03-25T20:12:59  <sipa> #21489
13262021-03-25T20:13:01  <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/21489 | fuzz: cleanups for versionbits fuzzer by ajtowns · Pull Request #21489 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
13272021-03-25T20:13:15  <sipa> aj: is the backport trivial/clean?
13282021-03-25T20:13:40  <wumpus> achow101: agree, and yes it seems ok for now
13292021-03-25T20:14:25  <aj> sipa: yes
13302021-03-25T20:16:53  <wumpus> at least its only a yellow warning
13312021-03-25T20:27:12  <luke-jr> achow101: bleh :/
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13372021-03-25T21:10:46  <wumpus> PSA: because of the windows signing key being revoked, i have for https://bitcoincore.org/bin/bitcoin-core-0.21.0/ and https://bitcoincore.org/bin/bitcoin-core-0.20.1/ moved the -setup.exe to an "archived" directory, uploaded the setup-unsigned.exe instead, also created and signed a new SHA256SUMS.asc with the alternative exe in it
13382021-03-25T21:11:58  <wumpus> this should make it at least possible to still install while we resolve the signign key issues
13392021-03-25T21:27:04  <hebasto> jonasschnelli_: maybe `libxkbcommon-x11-0:i386` package for Linux32 build?
13402021-03-25T21:27:13  *** jonasschnelli_ is now known as jonasschnelli
13412021-03-25T21:27:24  <jonasschnelli> hebasto just saw that. Will add
13422021-03-25T21:27:45  <hebasto> jonasschnelli: thanks
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13522021-03-25T22:01:58  <harding> wumpus: that breaks the links on https://bitcoincore.org/en/download/ ; is it possible to use the same file name, or is that just too problematic?
13532021-03-25T22:02:22  <harding> (I can also change the link on the download page if you'd prefer that.)
13542021-03-25T22:05:21  <wumpus> harding: that is a good idea but I don't feel like doing the entire process (like regenerate SHA256SUMS.asc) again
13552021-03-25T22:05:32  <wumpus> let's just change the link
13562021-03-25T22:05:37  <harding> wumpus: will do, thanks.
13572021-03-25T22:06:09  <wumpus> also the -unsigned in the file name will likely alert people what to expect
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