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111 2021-11-09T02:09:35 <luke-jr> hmm, clang 12 is getting picky about thread safety analysis (0.21.1 fails it)
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131 2021-11-09T02:30:01 <sipa> Chris_Stewart_5: can you fix your IRC client?
132 2021-11-09T02:30:10 <sipa> (you're joining/quitting every few minutes)
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172 2021-11-09T03:16:35 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] fanquake opened pull request #23470: doc: consolidate legacy wallet documentation (master...wallet_mess_cleanup) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23470
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220 2021-11-09T04:10:47 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] mbildwic opened pull request #23471: doc: Add more information about ZMQ topics (master...doc_add_zmq_desc) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23471
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388 2021-11-09T07:14:05 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] fanquake opened pull request #23473: build: boring autotools cleanup (master...boring_autotools_cleanup) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23473
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472 2021-11-09T08:54:58 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke pushed 3 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/c702d1fefddc...49143477e774
473 2021-11-09T08:54:58 <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master b971858 fanquake: doc: remove Boost build note from build-unix.md
474 2021-11-09T08:54:58 <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master ea360d6 fanquake: doc: remove redundant optionals from build-unix.md
475 2021-11-09T08:54:58 <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 4914347 MarcoFalke: Merge bitcoin/bitcoin#23469: doc: Remove Boost build note from build-unix....
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483 2021-11-09T09:00:56 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke pushed 2 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/49143477e774...94db963de501
484 2021-11-09T09:00:56 <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master facc352 MarcoFalke: test: Implicitly sync after generate*, unless opted out
485 2021-11-09T09:00:56 <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 94db963 MarcoFalke: Merge bitcoin/bitcoin#23300: test: Implicitly sync after generate*, unless...
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488 2021-11-09T09:01:13 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke merged pull request #23469: doc: Remove Boost build note from build-unix.md (master...remove_boost_note) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23469
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491 2021-11-09T09:01:31 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke merged pull request #23300: test: Implicitly sync after generate*, unless opted out (master...2110-testSyncImp) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23300
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522 2021-11-09T09:40:56 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke closed pull request #22567: test: Implicitly sync after generate* to preempt races and intermittent test failures (master...2107-testSync) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/22567
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529 2021-11-09T09:46:22 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke opened pull request #23474: test: scripted-diff cleanups after generate* changes (master...2107-testSync) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23474
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594 2021-11-09T11:06:17 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] brunoerg opened pull request #23475: wallet: add config to prioritize a solution that doesn't create change in coin selection (master...2021-11-coinselection-option) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23475
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679 2021-11-09T12:51:26 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 2 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/94db963de501...55dd38552446
680 2021-11-09T12:51:26 <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master bd9c6ad zealsham: wallet: Fixed Grammatical error in bdb.h
681 2021-11-09T12:51:26 <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 55dd385 W. J. van der Laan: Merge bitcoin/bitcoin#23414: wallet: Fix comment grammar in bdb.h
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684 2021-11-09T12:51:43 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj merged pull request #23414: wallet: Fix comment grammar in bdb.h (master...wallet-fix) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23414
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698 2021-11-09T13:13:07 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 2 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/55dd38552446...cb4adbd8ab1b
699 2021-11-09T13:13:07 <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 79fd28c amadeuszpawlik: Adds verification step to Schnorr and ECDSA signing
700 2021-11-09T13:13:07 <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master cb4adbd W. J. van der Laan: Merge bitcoin/bitcoin#22934: Add verification to `Sign`, `SignCompact` and...
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703 2021-11-09T13:13:24 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj merged pull request #22934: Add verification to `Sign`, `SignCompact` and `SignSchnorr` (master...schnorr_sig) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/22934
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710 2021-11-09T13:21:42 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] hebasto opened pull request #23476: ci, qa: Adjust timeouts per test instead of global `--timeout-factor` (master...211109-timeout) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23476
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751 2021-11-09T14:25:10 <laanwj> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23470#issuecomment-964196414 i really think we're going too fast deprecating berkeleydb wallets
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754 2021-11-09T14:26:20 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] hebasto closed pull request #23476: ci, qa: Adjust timeouts per test instead of global `--timeout-factor` (master...211109-timeout) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23476
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763 2021-11-09T14:35:21 <shiza> fanquake wants documentation not to misled new users to berkelydb. That's a good idea.
764 2021-11-09T14:36:01 <laanwj> i did this in build-unix.md by moving the (descriptor wallet) paragraphs to the top
765 2021-11-09T14:37:42 <laanwj> that's fine, i just think it's too early to hide all of it away, and if you do, we're going to get a lot of complaines from people that can no longer open their wallet
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767 2021-11-09T14:40:19 <sipa> laanwj: it does feel rushed
768 2021-11-09T14:40:33 <sipa> i thought the plan wasn't to remove bdb wallets for a few years at least
769 2021-11-09T14:41:16 <laanwj> this is only about removing the documentation, but still, yes, it feels rushed to me too
770 2021-11-09T14:41:47 <sipa> right, i'm aware
771 2021-11-09T14:42:09 <sipa> it's not because new wallets will by default by sqlite, that we can say that bdb support is something most users don't need to care about anymore
772 2021-11-09T14:42:16 <laanwj> we have to acknowledge the fact that a lot of people will, for various reasons, still be using legacy wallets for a long time
773 2021-11-09T14:42:19 <laanwj> right
774 2021-11-09T14:42:27 <shiza> This doesn't remove the documentation, just demotes it to a file of its own.
775 2021-11-09T14:43:04 <laanwj> i just think it's too early for that, let's wait a major release
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781 2021-11-09T14:48:51 <jnewbery> it seems reasonable to me to collect the legacy wallet documentation into one place
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785 2021-11-09T14:54:24 <sipa> perhaps, but it's going as far as not even listing the libdb dependency anymore
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787 2021-11-09T14:54:47 <sipa> except under a one-sentence link "For information on the legacy wallet"
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791 2021-11-09T14:58:44 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] jamesob closed pull request #23468: make Python bindings externally usable (master...2021-10-python-packaging) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23468
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794 2021-11-09T14:59:09 <jnewbery> #23381 is possible RFM
795 2021-11-09T14:59:11 <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/23381 | validation/refactor: refactoring for package submission by glozow · Pull Request #23381 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
796 2021-11-09T15:00:23 <laanwj> sipa: right, i think that's my problem with it
797 2021-11-09T15:01:13 <laanwj> not the idea of condensing documentation; i'd be first to agree there's a lot of duplication between the different unix-flavor instructions
798 2021-11-09T15:01:38 <laanwj> jnewbery: thanks, will take a look
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808 2021-11-09T15:15:35 <fanquake> Not just duplication, a lot of it is just outright misleading for new users / builders
809 2021-11-09T15:16:02 *** z9z0b3t1c <z9z0b3t1c!z9z0b3t1c@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/z9z0b3t1c> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
810 2021-11-09T15:16:17 <fanquake> âBDB is needed for wallet supportâ and similar is not correct. Anyone building Core today, shouldnât have to care, or know about BDB.
811 2021-11-09T15:17:33 <fanquake> In that case I donât see the problem with not listing the bdb dependency outright, as itâs not going to be relevant to anyone reading the docs for the first time.
812 2021-11-09T15:17:54 <earnestly> (Another concern is the version of it)
813 2021-11-09T15:19:24 <fanquake> None of this is helped by the confusing reference to wallets by about 4 different names. BDB wallets vs legacy wallets vs SQLite wallets vs descriptor wallets vs just âthe walletâ etc. Ideally we just have âthe walletâ and legacy wallets, I donât think descriptor is relevant, nor should really leak into build docs.
814 2021-11-09T15:19:51 <sipa> fanquake: i'd expect most users building Bitcoin Core to want BDB support, for a few years at least
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816 2021-11-09T15:20:35 <sipa> you're right that it's wrong to say it's "needed for wallet support", but that's very different from saying people shouldn't have to care about it?
817 2021-11-09T15:20:48 <fanquake> sipa: not sure when I said that?
818 2021-11-09T15:21:13 <sipa> you literally said that just here
819 2021-11-09T15:21:21 *** kexkey <kexkey!~kexkey@static-198-54-132-165.cust.tzulo.com> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
820 2021-11-09T15:21:35 <fanquake> Yes, new users shouldnât care?
821 2021-11-09T15:21:36 <_aj_> "Anyone building Core today, shouldnât have to care, or know about BDB"
822 2021-11-09T15:21:51 <fanquake> Why would they use BDB wallets, which we are actively deprecating
823 2021-11-09T15:22:01 <sipa> are we?
824 2021-11-09T15:22:18 <sipa> there is huge difference between new users and everyone building bitcoin core
825 2021-11-09T15:22:33 <sipa> yes, new wallets won't be BDB anymore
826 2021-11-09T15:22:34 <fanquake> #20160
827 2021-11-09T15:22:35 <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/20160 | Proposed Timeline for Legacy Wallet and BDB removal · Issue #20160 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
828 2021-11-09T15:22:48 <_aj_> (they might have been using pre-compiled binaries befor, and only now have started building themselves too)
829 2021-11-09T15:23:44 <sipa> hmm, that's a bit faster than i would have aimed for, but ok... we still intend to fully support bdb wallets until 2023 according to that
830 2021-11-09T15:24:15 <sipa> i'd expect most users today to find it surprising that they can't load their existing wallets when building with the recommemded procedure
831 2021-11-09T15:25:57 <fanquake> How to build with BDB is still going to be on the docs, just not spread all over the place, duplicating the same info.
832 2021-11-09T15:26:08 <sipa> i'm not objecting to that
833 2021-11-09T15:26:20 <sipa> only to removing it from the dependencies
834 2021-11-09T15:26:58 <sipa> i feel like actual deprecation (like this documentation change seems to be) and how, is a discussion to be had when there is an actual migration path
835 2021-11-09T15:26:58 <fanquake> Itâs still going to be in depends, and have the script to build it as well
836 2021-11-09T15:27:58 <sipa> well, not everyone builds that way
837 2021-11-09T15:28:41 <fanquake> I donât really no how we ended up with build docs that duplicate a list of our dependencies (separate from install instruction) in each build-* when we have a dependencies.md, although is a separate issue
838 2021-11-09T15:28:42 *** RDK <RDK!~RDK@p200300db671ff655e411201a29501db2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
839 2021-11-09T15:29:07 <sipa> fanquake: that's fair, and i have no objection whatsoever to improving that
840 2021-11-09T15:30:29 <sipa> but i feel that someone just following build instruction, without following links to things marked as legacy, should end up with a binary that supports bdb wallets
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842 2021-11-09T15:31:49 <_aj_> #23168 was really what removed it from the build dependencies, no?
843 2021-11-09T15:31:50 <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/23168 | build: no-longer fail default configure if BDB isnt available by fanquake · Pull Request #23168 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
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845 2021-11-09T15:32:33 <fanquake> No. That just removed the incredibly annoying behaviour of having configure fail if you didnât have BDB installed, and werenât passing âdisable-wallet
846 2021-11-09T15:33:33 <gjvc> fanquake, yes. that was annoying. :-/
847 2021-11-09T15:34:29 <fanquake> A default configure invocation really shouldnât fail if youâve got the minimum required build dependencies installed, and donât care about anything else.
848 2021-11-09T15:34:48 <_aj_> passing --disable-bdb-wallet would have let you do sqlite only wallets too. the difference is what happens when you run ./configure naively, and don't have bdb installed -- do you get an error forcing you to not be naive, or do you get a bitcoind that won't open your wallet?
849 2021-11-09T15:35:02 *** brunoerg <brunoerg!~brunoerg@187.183.47.88> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
850 2021-11-09T15:35:26 <_aj_> s/would have/could have/
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852 2021-11-09T15:35:52 <fanquake> Youâll likely get a bitcoind that will open SQLite wallets, but not BDB
853 2021-11-09T15:36:25 <fanquake> It still warns in some cases, and will fail if youâve exploited opted for BDB but donât have the dependency
854 2021-11-09T15:36:42 <fanquake> *explicitly
855 2021-11-09T15:38:39 *** Guyver2 <Guyver2!Guyver@guyver2.xs4all.nl> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
856 2021-11-09T15:39:14 <_aj_> yeah, i think for something as important as being able to open your old wallet, the default / implict behaviour should be "be able to open old wallets" unless you very explicitly opt-out (either with --disable-wallet or some --disable-bdb-wallet). otherwise you're going to give people heart attacks. just my opinion though, not my hill to die on
857 2021-11-09T15:39:29 *** brunoerg <brunoerg!~brunoerg@187.183.47.88> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
858 2021-11-09T15:39:38 <_aj_> so if you don't opt-out but don't have the dependencies, should be an error
859 2021-11-09T15:39:47 <_aj_> (at configure time)
860 2021-11-09T15:40:25 <fanquake> But, for the most part, wonât all these people who have already been compiling, have the dependencies, and thus will get the correct wallet support
861 2021-11-09T15:41:06 <_aj_> maybe they switched to a new machine, or did an upgrade and lost some packages, or setup a new build chroot
862 2021-11-09T15:41:09 *** drgrid is now known as TheCharlatan
863 2021-11-09T15:41:25 <_aj_> maybe they weren't compiling and are just starting
864 2021-11-09T15:42:36 <fanquake> I donât agree that having configure fail, by default, unless you install a maybe? âdeprecatedâ dependency, or pass additional flags, is a good behaviour
865 2021-11-09T15:42:50 <_aj_> maybe their old system got hacked and they're setting up a new system hoping that the hacker didn't copy their wallet.dat or they can at least sweep their funds before the attacker cracks their password
866 2021-11-09T15:42:52 <fanquake> Especially not for a new user, or one that doesnât care about the Core wallet etc
867 2021-11-09T15:43:49 <_aj_> i don't think using existing bdb wallets should be / is deprecated yet
868 2021-11-09T15:43:52 <fanquake> Right, so where do we draw the line for this then? Do we start hard failing of SQLite isnât available too? To much the old behaviour?
869 2021-11-09T15:45:00 <fanquake> It sounds like we need more discussion in #20160 then. As that currently states that we are going to mark legacy bdb wallets as deprecated started with 23.0
870 2021-11-09T15:45:01 <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/20160 | Proposed Timeline for Legacy Wallet and BDB removal · Issue #20160 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
871 2021-11-09T15:45:17 <_aj_> yeah, hard failing if you don't have sqlite dev and don't specify --disable-sqlite-wallet or --disable-wallet seems sensible to me if sqlite's the default going forward. same reasoning as --with-incompatible-bdb
872 2021-11-09T15:45:51 <_aj_> it says marking the creation of new legacy bdb wallets as deprecated, not using existing bdb wallets
873 2021-11-09T15:46:16 <sipa> having a migration tool also factors into this
874 2021-11-09T15:46:22 <fanquake> And when loading legacy warn that they will soon be unsupported
875 2021-11-09T15:46:32 <_aj_> presumably can't build the migration tool without bdb libraries available though?
876 2021-11-09T15:46:41 <sipa> right
877 2021-11-09T15:46:58 *** bitcoin-git <bitcoin-git!~bitcoin-g@x0f.org> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
878 2021-11-09T15:46:58 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj pushed 11 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/cb4adbd8ab1b...e70fb87a4f8c
879 2021-11-09T15:46:58 <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 0a79eab glozow: [validation] case-based constructors for ATMPArgs
880 2021-11-09T15:46:58 <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master cbb3598 glozow: [validation/refactor] store precomputed txdata in workspace
881 2021-11-09T15:46:58 <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 8fa2936 glozow: [validation] re-introduce bool for whether a transaction is RBF
882 2021-11-09T15:47:00 *** bitcoin-git <bitcoin-git!~bitcoin-g@x0f.org> has left #bitcoin-core-dev
883 2021-11-09T15:47:15 *** bitcoin-git <bitcoin-git!~bitcoin-g@x0f.org> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
884 2021-11-09T15:47:15 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] laanwj merged pull request #23381: validation/refactor: refactoring for package submission (master...2021-10-validation-refactors) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23381
885 2021-11-09T15:47:16 *** bitcoin-git <bitcoin-git!~bitcoin-g@x0f.org> has left #bitcoin-core-dev
886 2021-11-09T15:47:18 <_aj_> fanquake: right, "soon be unsupported" ==> "currently completely supported"
887 2021-11-09T15:47:19 <sipa> building the migration tool doesn't as strongly depend on having bdb 4.8 though; it can use later versions too
888 2021-11-09T15:47:40 <sipa> which simplifies things somewhat
889 2021-11-09T15:48:07 <fanquake> _aj_ sure, and âdeprecatedâ is somewhere in between those two
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891 2021-11-09T15:49:19 <fanquake> At least the failing without SQLite case is somewhat mitigated bu the fact that it is much more prevalent
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894 2021-11-09T15:51:59 <_aj_> fanquake: well, the version doesn't matter much for everything but bdb which is a bigger deal? otherwise it's just "you need to install boost, sqlite, bdb, etc; do that; run configure"
895 2021-11-09T15:52:10 <sipa> but if building the prospective migration tool will also require libdb, i'd say it's even more too early to not list libdb as a dependency anymore
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902 2021-11-09T15:57:42 <laanwj> yes, the migration tool could use any bdb version, it can open the database read-only or if that's not possible, make a copy then open it, to prevent the source file from becoming incompatible
903 2021-11-09T15:57:59 <achow101> fwiw, if you try to open a bdb wallet without having bdb compiled, you will be informed that BDB support was not compiled rather than a mysterious error
904 2021-11-09T15:58:20 <achow101> I also have a version of the migration tool that will work without bdb entirely
905 2021-11-09T15:58:48 <laanwj> that's neat, it does seem a bit more risky to me
906 2021-11-09T15:59:16 *** AaronvanW <AaronvanW!~AaronvanW@65.205-252-62.static.virginmediabusiness.co.uk> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)
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908 2021-11-09T15:59:50 <laanwj> e.g. when you'd be reimplementing bdb reading logic, you'd want to be really sure to not accidentally lose keys
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910 2021-11-09T16:02:02 <achow101> yeah. the idea is to first have a version that uses bdb, then later use the one without bdb. then we can test the bdb-less migration against the one with bdb using feature_backwards_compatibility.py (or something like that)
911 2021-11-09T16:02:16 <laanwj> sounds good to me
912 2021-11-09T16:03:34 *** Guest75 <Guest75!~Guest75@176.232.58.44> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
913 2021-11-09T16:03:46 <Guest75> Hello.
914 2021-11-09T16:04:19 *** Guest75 <Guest75!~Guest75@176.232.58.44> has quit IRC (Client Quit)
915 2021-11-09T16:05:29 *** Guest75 <Guest75!~Guest75@176.232.58.44> has joined #bitcoin-core-dev
916 2021-11-09T16:05:30 <Guest75> Â #startmeeting
917 2021-11-09T16:06:14 <Guest75> I read a news that the source codes of Bitcoin will be removed from github, what is the truth of this?
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938 2021-11-09T16:30:57 <shiza> The migration tool supports incompatible bdb? Nice.
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964 2021-11-09T17:06:07 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] RandyMcMillan closed pull request #23449: contrib/install_db4.sh: http_get if tar.gz does not exist (master...install-db4-check) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23449
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972 2021-11-09T17:12:17 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke pushed 2 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/e70fb87a4f8c...8ae4ba481ce8
973 2021-11-09T17:12:17 <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 037c9ee Sebastian Falbesoner: fix `XOnlyPubKey::IsFullyValid` comment reference
974 2021-11-09T17:12:17 <bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 8ae4ba4 MarcoFalke: Merge bitcoin/bitcoin#23400: doc: fix `XOnlyPubKey::IsFullyValid` comment ...
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977 2021-11-09T17:12:34 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke merged pull request #23400: doc: fix `XOnlyPubKey::IsFullyValid` comment reference (master...202110-doc-fix_xonlypubkey_isvalid_comment) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23400
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998 2021-11-09T17:39:00 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] jnewbery opened pull request #23477: addrman: tidy-ups to unit tests (master...2021-11-addrman-tidyups) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23477
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1198 2021-11-09T21:13:00 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] achow101 closed pull request #20096: wallet: Remove WalletDatabase refcounting and enforce only one Batch access the database at a time (master...rm-bdb-refcount) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/20096
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1237 2021-11-09T21:53:10 <bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] hebasto opened pull request #23478: build: Add support for Android NDK r23 LTS (master...211109-binutils) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/23478
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1322 2021-11-09T23:47:12 <Chris_Stewart_5> What is the purpose of this HandleMissingData() : https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/77a2f5d30c5ecb764b8a7c098492e1f5cdec90f0/src/script/interpreter.cpp#L1714
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1331 2021-11-09T23:55:43 <Chris_Stewart_5> I guess i don't understand why we wouldn't fail earlier if data is missing rather than failing in the signature checker/interpreter
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